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Broomstick wrote: But keep in mind the accusations of a Vulcan invasion fleet are from a human - the opening sequence, which shows the first contact, shows nothing to indicate either way whether the Vulcans are invading or not invading.

That's my fault, I missed the opening on Saturday and didn't know its importance until everyone else began posting.

That's it.

It doesn't change how crappy the Tholian was shown in this episode.

When it exploded, we saw.....polygons

Hmmm looks like they now have a Connie set ......oooooo

Okay, the preview for next weeks episode on this page looks pretty damn fantastic, lots of action with the Defiant... and some total human vapourisation

Jon wrote:Okay, the preview for next weeks episode on this page looks pretty damn fantastic, lots of action with the Defiant... and some total human vapourisation

Not to mention a Gorn for the first time since Arena; that should prove interesting to see Westmore take a crack at it.

Grand Moff Yenchin wrote:

That's it.

It doesn't change how crappy the Tholian was shown in this episode.

When it exploded, we saw.....polygons

We say polygons because Tholians are apparently some sort of crystaline lifeform. It really wasn't that bad going by computer generated TV alien standards. It isn't like they could have done much else to it to make it look more detailed without accusations of shitting on continuity being flung about.

Holy shit, first Tholians, now the Gorn?

It's like it's my God damn birthday...

Spanky The Dolphin wrote:Wrong, We did see Tholian Commander Loskene in "The Tholian Web," as I already showed on the first page, but here it is again:

http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/Image:Tholian.jpg

However, this is the first time we've seen them clearly.

Yeah, right, I saw that as soon as I posted. Hey, it's only been about 20 years since I last saw the episode.

This is the first time we see 'em clearly.

Yeah, and notice that I said that, too.

I found a place that has a .avi file of the intro
http://downloads.scifinews.de/file_31698.html

The intro gives me the impression that the Terran Empire was founded during the Great Depression (possibly in the U.S.)

FedRebel wrote:I found a place that has a .avi file of the intro
http://downloads.scifinews.de/file_31698.html

The intro gives me the impression that the Terran Empire was founded during the Great Depression (possibly in the U.S.)

Meaning that the Divergence point may go back to before First Contact. Perhaps next week will answer this, perhaps not.

And if anybody finds an mp3 to the special theme, I'd like to know.

JME2 wrote: Meaning that the Divergence point may go back to before First Contact. Perhaps next week will answer this, perhaps not.

Seeing as how an Imperial flag is planted on the moon before the Phenoix is shown, and the first presentation of the Terran symbol is just after a WWI scene...

The divergence point certainly does go back before FC

FedRebel wrote:

JME2 wrote: Meaning that the Divergence point may go back to before First Contact. Perhaps next week will answer this, perhaps not.

Seeing as how an Imperial flag is planted on the moon before the Phenoix is shown, and the first presentation of the Terran symbol is just after a WWI scene...

The divergence point certainly does go back before FC

Perhaps it has something to do with the Edith Keeler incident, then?

Drooling Iguana wrote:

FedRebel wrote:

JME2 wrote: Meaning that the Divergence point may go back to before First Contact. Perhaps next week will answer this, perhaps not.

Seeing as how an Imperial flag is planted on the moon before the Phenoix is shown, and the first presentation of the Terran symbol is just after a WWI scene...

The divergence point certainly does go back before FC

Perhaps it has something to do with the Edith Keeler incident, then?

Hmm.

Interesting hypothesis. You know, that may just be it. Sadly, though, I doubt this will prove true.

JME2 wrote:

Drooling Iguana wrote:

FedRebel wrote: Seeing as how an Imperial flag is planted on the moon before the Phenoix is shown, and the first presentation of the Terran symbol is just after a WWI scene...

The divergence point certainly does go back before FC

Perhaps it has something to do with the Edith Keeler incident, then?

Hmm.

Interesting hypothesis. You know, that may just be it. Sadly, though, I doubt this will prove true.

Edith Keeler prevented the US from entering WWII. If the Terrans are already around by WWI, I doubt she would be the critical factor.

Eugenics wars what if the "supermen" had won?

Typhonis 1 wrote:Eugenics wars what if the "supermen" had won?

again, that happens way too late to be the divergence point, which has to be sometime pre-WWI.

Wow, I just saw the intro. That was glorious

Drooling Iguana wrote:

FedRebel wrote:

JME2 wrote: Meaning that the Divergence point may go back to before First Contact. Perhaps next week will answer this, perhaps not.

Seeing as how an Imperial flag is planted on the moon before the Phenoix is shown, and the first presentation of the Terran symbol is just after a WWI scene...
The divergence point certainly does go back before FC

Perhaps it has something to do with the Edith Keeler incident, then?

Hmm, maybe WWI happened differently.
The main problem with either of those two explanations is that I can't picture the Terran Empire starting out as Nazis or Soviets or any RL society that stood a chance of world domination. They're just too culturally different from anything on RL modern Earth. The best candidate I can think of offhand for the proto-TE is the Draka, and even that hardly seems likely. My money is on the divergence point being way back in ancient history.
I have two theories. One is that in the Mirror Universe the American and French revolutions were failures. The world was left in the hands of the monarchal/totalitarian European colonial powers, which eventually merged into the TE. The other is that Sparta instead of Athens had the bigger influence on the intellectual and cultural development of Western civ in the Mirror Universe, so the whole society evolved in a more warlike bend.

Spanky the Dolphin wrote:Holy shit, first Tholians, now the Gorn?
It's like it's my God damn birthday...

Yeah, but the episode could still have been so much better. I don't at all like the way they brought these species in. "Oh, they're Tholian slaves..." Give me a fucking break, that's such an obvious "let's cram as many cool species in there as we can in 1/2 an hour" mentality. And the horrible ham acting...
I'm actually seriously intrigued by the concept of a show set in the mirror universe. I really loved the gritty, militaristic feel of the episode. It was really refreshing after the usual Trek sixties-hippie atmosphere. But not the way the creators of Enterschlok would pull it off.

Since I usually have to mute the intro to Enterprise, that was certainly a nice change!

Would have preferred this series over what we got for the last couple years, but oh well ...

And now for a few screenies ... some good, some bad ...

Hoshi you Ho' she!

Promoted to First Bi-yotch!

I.S.S. Enterprise

"I shoot you!"

"I bring bigger guns!"

Death Commando Mayweather

"This may hurt a little"

"And here's what the ship looks like on acid ..."

Familiar surroundings

"Quick, engage cloak before Berman can edit the script!"

You know, maybe there was no diverging point. It isn't really an alternate time line as it is an independent, parallel universe.

Perhaps the Mirror Universe was always "evil."

Jolene Blalock looks great with long hair.

What the FUCK is it with this bullshit "Vulcans must all have Spock's hairdo" brainbug? Jesus fucking Christ. Spock was SUPPOSED to look like a Geek, because he was one. EVERY Vulcan in TOS had a different hairdo, especially the women, Valeris, Saavick, T'Pol, T'Pring. I might have actually liked watching this show if the Hot Chick (tm) actually LOOKED like a chick. Fucking TNG with their "Everyone must look the same" bullshit utopian fuckshit.

End Gripe.

I don't think it was "utopian" so much as it was "lazy" and "incompetent."

I don't know what made me laugh more in this tread, the topic at hand or Spanky replying "Son of a bitch" after that one post. Shit.

Too bad I missed this. I want to see them in TOS uniforms. Is that next week?

Second time this season they made me feel like tuning in to watch. The first time this season was the Vulcan arc's final episode but that one just made me go... meh! Should I tune in to watch this?

Old Plympto wrote:Second time this season they made me feel like tuning in to watch. The first time this season was the Vulcan arc's final episode but that one just made me go... meh! Should I tune in to watch this?

I say yes. A very strong yes. There are little things like excessive sparks during combat and the warpcore out of control thing and probably others, but for all intents and purposes this is not Enterprise. It is better. (I simply cannot wait for the next episode!!).

AND IT HAS THE CONNIE!!!!