StarDestroyer.Net BBS

Sidewinder wrote:According to one of the 'Tales...' *snip*

Interesting, thanks

Well, I can see why we're discussing Greedo's competency as a bounty hunter. It's quite relevant when we're discussing the morality of Han shooting first (and we know he did).
I believe it was perfectly justified. Regardless of Greedo's inexperience, when there's someone pointing a gun at you over a table, they're a legitimate lethal threat, because no one could have missed a shot from that range!

^ Totally, I just got off on a tangent thinking about plausible causes for it to go down the way it did besides Occam's Razor's "Greedo's a dumbass." I apologize if this was too far off-topic.

I believe I read that Lucas is planning on creating 3D versions of the entire trilogy that will be shown in a few years time, basically using the original films and using modern digital 3D technology to convert them. If that occurs, there could be some minor tweaks to special effects and other bits of editing, but it is unlikely that it would constitute anything close to a "remake." What could be interesting, though, would be added footage of the lightsabre duel between Vader and Obi Wan in ANH, with the new footage (probably using Ewan McGregor with considerable amounts of make-up) being interspersed in between the classic original shots with Alec Guiness.

Wow, your post just gave me flashbacks of the 1998 "Anniversary Edition" of Night of the Living Dead, with new scenes of the cemetary zombie actor 30 years older and 20 lbs heavier, in lots of makeup running around (not to mention the Anton LeVay look-alike priest and the producer's daughter with missing arm!). Would be surreal...

Better to just use a stuntman with Alec Guiness' face added on like they did with Christopher Lee in the prequels.

Hmm.

I was about to voice disagreement, but I thought about it for some time, and I can't say I'm opposed to the Obi-Wan/Darth Vader duel being redone. It's in stark contrast to the rest of the cinematic (though unrealistic) twirly lightsaber combat in the PT, and even the later OT duels.

I would not approve of Alec Guiness's likeness being reused, as reusing the image of a dead actor strikes me as being a tad, unnatural. What you could do though, is leave all the original footage intact, and simply cut the new duel into it. Ewan McGregor looks enough like Alec Guiness that with a bit of makeup, it would be hard to tell the added shots apart from the originals. As a result, the whole fight sequence could be stretched out to as long as 15 minutes, and made a more epic component of ANH.

Since Obi-wan had his robe's hood up during the duel you could just have say, Nic Gillard (the stunt coordnator who coreographed all the lightsaber fights for the PT) dressed up as Kenobi and shoot the scenes so you couldn't see his face.

Do you think they should change the whole "struck down and dissipate" ending? And what about Yoda's death?

In my opinion it would be fine, as long as they didn't make it gory or if it had any screaming, severed limbs, etc. They should both go down noble, as in the OT.

The problem with that CoS, is it would destroy the entire subplot about Qui Gonn discovering this bizarre mystical shit with the coming back from the netherworld of the living force and so on.

Changing the fight at all would be a really bad idea. It works perfectly as it is, with the exception of the glitchy saber effect. It shouldn't be all flashy and dramatic, it's a fight between old men with vast experience. It's perfect contrast, both of them fighting with control and precision over flailing around randomly. If anything, the prequel duels should be re-done to a more realistic style.

I really don't get why people think it's such a great idea to keep revising the movies. They work just fine as they are, none of these proposed additions would add anything to the movie. It's the worst of the revisionism, changing things just for the sake of changing things.

lPeregrine wrote:Changing the fight at all would be a really bad idea. It works perfectly as it is, with the exception of the glitchy saber effect. It shouldn't be all flashy and dramatic, it's a fight between old men with vast experience. It's perfect contrast, both of them fighting with control and precision over flailing around randomly. If anything, the prequel duels should be re-done to a more realistic style.

I really don't get why people think it's such a great idea to keep revising the movies. They work just fine as they are, none of these proposed additions would add anything to the movie. It's the worst of the revisionism, changing things just for the sake of changing things.

To support this idea, just note the battle between Palpatine and Windu. The two fight in a duel very similar to the one between Vader and Kenobi in SW4. I recall someone pointing out that Force users of very close combat skill actually prevent and interfere with the other's movements? It would seem to fit the slower, strategic pace.

So it's not as if the SW4 battle is completely out of place.

Elessar wrote:To support this idea, just note the battle between Palpatine and Windu. The two fight in a duel very similar to the one between Vader and Kenobi in SW4. I recall someone pointing out that Force users of very close combat skill actually prevent and interfere with the other's movements? It would seem to fit the slower, strategic pace.

So it's not as if the SW4 battle is completely out of place.

I think the fight between Palpatine and Windu was slow-paced mostly because of Samuel L. Jackson's bad choreography. I'm not sure if he had the same choreographer as the others in the film, but I think he performed badly...

But that's the out-of-universe explanation. In-universe, we assume that they were actively using the Force to inhibit each other's movements. Though if Force users of roughly equal skill did inhibit movement to such an extreme, then it would have manifested itself in the duel on Mustafar. Or the duel between Yoda and Sidious.

Also consider that last time Vader and Obi-Wan fought, Vader overestimated himself and nearly got killed. He's had two decades to reflect on his foolish mistake, so he's not going to go all big and bad on Obi only to embarass himself again.

Doctor Doom wrote:But that's the out-of-universe explanation. In-universe, we assume that they were actively using the Force to inhibit each other's movements. Though if Force users of roughly equal skill did inhibit movement to such an extreme, then it would have manifested itself in the duel on Mustafar. Or the duel between Yoda and Sidious.

This would suggest that the duels on Mustafar and between Yoda and Sidious weren't as closely matched as they seemed. However, it could also suggest that the participants in those battles just weren't of the same style. Sidious was not exactly bouncing around against Yoda. While Yoda was, it seems like his whole lightsabre strategy is to sonic-furball an opponent and thus have sufficient counters already devised.

As for Mustafar, wasn't the early part of the duel similar to Windu vs Palpatine?

This would suggest that the duels on Mustafar and between Yoda and Sidious weren't as closely matched as they seemed. However, it could also suggest that the participants in those battles just weren't of the same style. Sidious was not exactly bouncing around against Yoda. While Yoda was, it seems like his whole lightsabre strategy is to sonic-furball an opponent and thus have sufficient counters already devised.

Exactly. It comes down to a matter of lightsaber style, not skill. The prequels and Clone War-era EU make it quite clear that the deciding factor in lightsaber duels are the respective fencing styles of the combatants. So because the duel looks tame does not mean that the two combatants are of equal skill levels, but it rather has something to do with their respective combat styles.

Note, I am not trying to downgrade the importance of skill in these matters. I actually agree with the idea that the skill of the combatants changes the way the battle goes due to the interference of the Force, I just didn't want people to forget the influence of various lightsaber fencing styles.

Cos Dashit wrote:

Elessar wrote:To support this idea, just note the battle between Palpatine and Windu. The two fight in a duel very similar to the one between Vader and Kenobi in SW4. I recall someone pointing out that Force users of very close combat skill actually prevent and interfere with the other's movements? It would seem to fit the slower, strategic pace.

So it's not as if the SW4 battle is completely out of place.

I think the fight between Palpatine and Windu was slow-paced mostly because of Samuel L. Jackson's bad choreography. I'm not sure if he had the same choreographer as the others in the film, but I think he performed badly...

actually the main reason the Mace vs. Palpatine fight is so slow is that got redone (IIRC in day of the shooting) with more close-ups of Palpatine which meant that Ian McDiarmid (who did admit that he's no swardman) had to a) learn to fight with lightsaber prop and b)do much more then orginally intended.

I think all the space battle scenes in the OT could be re-done with CGI. Especially the Battle of Endor. After seeing the Battle of Coruscant in ROTS Endor looks like a light skirmish.

Pax Britannia wrote:I think all the space battle scenes in the OT could be re-done with CGI. Especially the Battle of Endor. After seeing the Battle of Coruscant in ROTS Endor looks like a light skirmish.

Considering the ship numbers involved, it was. Giving the Rebels thousands of capital ships like the CIS had wouldn't make any sense, given their position.

Personally, I don't mind the OT space battle scenes at all, although I wouldn't mind seeing a modern version.

Maybe your right. But they should make an adjustment to the Imperial fleet sizes to compensate.

Mayby they should put more ships in the background, But the actual action-sequences are far better at the battle of Endor than in RotS.

Pax Britannia wrote:I think all the space battle scenes in the OT could be re-done with CGI. Especially the Battle of Endor. After seeing the Battle of Coruscant in ROTS Endor looks like a light skirmish.

I disagree. The OT's fights were, in my opinion, well done and fun to watch. Although I did like the broadside in the opening scene of RotS between Grevious' ship and the Republic's. That was fun.

Personally, I think that adding some TIE fighters and assorted rebel fighters using CGI could be nice. You'd have fighters whirling around in a death dance as the key squadrons of the battles desperately tried to get through to their objective rather than being scythed down in waves of antistarfighter fire. And picture the explosion effects we could get for the Death Stars with modern CGI technology.

But leave the rest alone, I like the rest.