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Fingolfin_Noldor wrote:SiegeTank, at the rate all these visits are going, it will take forever to finish writing them. In unreal time, I'm going to stage a visit to San Dorado, and of course, pray at the local Orthodox Basilica over the grave of the conquistador.

Alright, I've welcomed the Emperor with all the pomp and circumstance befitting one such as he. I suggest we talk at the Presidential Palace, and then I'll accompany you to the Neon Cathedral (or alternatively we can do that the next day or something). I'm sure the Emperor's visit to the basilica is the dream of the Patriarch of the Autocephalous Patriarchate of San Dorado .

SiegeTank wrote:

RogueIce wrote:Speaking of the FTO, I did request an observer status at the Cascadian Conference. Did you guys ever decide on that?

As far as I'm concerned you're quite welcome.

I concur.

Hey Coiler, how much are you asking for the LHA? My amphibious assault capability is a tad lacking at the moment.

Master_Baerne wrote: Hey Coiler, how much are you asking for the LHA? My amphibious assault capability is a tad lacking at the moment.

$500 million.

A few more questions for Coiler:

1. What model are the Burkes? Are they Flight I or Flight IIA?
2. What price are you charging for the Burkes? Cash only, or are materiel exchanges acceptable?
3. What classes are your AOEs and AKEs, and how much are you charging for them?

Sea Skimmer wrote:\
Its not my fault people are too damn ignorant to even copy and paste together the NATO and USSR OOBs I offered up which showed in great detail what can be afforded.. It is however a problem that people don’t fucking know how to make a military, and don’t know how to fight one, and yet the game gets a new war every week.

Well, far be it from me to suggest that because the players don't know how to fight wars doesn't mean it should be assumed that entire military and defense bureaucracies who's very jobs are to do so don't know either, nor are capable of contemplating possible threats and developing techniques, doctrines, and equipment to deal with them.

As for conflicts, things are actually peaceful now. We have what? A low intensity conflict in the CFR? That's about it, globally, well, save for your suppression of the New Sumatrese guerrila forces. I suppose Astaria could declare war on the CSR, but aside from indulging in anti-commerce warfare with SSKs and attempting long-range strikes with their air force, what else can Astaria do? And odds are such a campaign would only result in the Astarian Air Force and SSK fleet being trunucated.

Norseman wrote:Happier still without the CSR involvement, it's time consuming, and I think it's a bit over the top.

"A bit"? I went no-holds-barred (well, almost) precisely to disrupt your communications. In case I'm wasting too much of your time to play in a military exchange, I can simply withdraw the attack however. I don't really want to spoil someone's free time with something he isn't ready to participate in. I can say that I simply sent several Tu-160s at extreme altitudes to conduct indiscriminate bombings of seaports with hypersonic ALCMs... instead of the massive attack I conducted.

So, what say you? Withdraw or reply? In any case, people already had a glimpse at C.S.R. military tactics when it comes to trans-oceanic engagements.

Coiler wrote:

Master_Baerne wrote: Hey Coiler, how much are you asking for the LHA? My amphibious assault capability is a tad lacking at the moment.

$500 million.

Accepted. When will it be decommissioned?

I have a feeling General Sheppard will devise an appropriately disproportional response to the bombing...

Fingolfin_Noldor wrote:I have a feeling General Sheppard will devise an appropriately disproportional response to the bombing...

Langley Carbombs Shep, Shep sends in the fire ships to every port on Langley?

Karmic Knight wrote:

Fingolfin_Noldor wrote:I have a feeling General Sheppard will devise an appropriately disproportional response to the bombing...

Langley Carbombs Shep, Shep sends in the fire ships to every port on Langley?

*shrug* Could well be a bundle of "joy" involving biotoxins.

McCauley, Cheritto, Shiherlis, and their ilk are not Langley nationals, and none of them will live to see the next sunrise once the LNP's done with them.

Stas Bush wrote:So, what say you? Withdraw or reply? In any case, people already had a glimpse at C.S.R. military tactics when it comes to trans-oceanic engagements.

Probably best if we withdraw, not least because it's far easier to get people to agree to what ACLM damage would be like. Are we talking INS only, followed by a quick radar update when they hit the coast?

However for the record Astaria *has* scatterback radar. If Australia has a scatterback system, then Astaria with roughly the same GNP (certainly PPP), and a much greater need (not to say military budget) would have one as well. Marina didn't specify whether I had one of those or not (nor whether I had AFBs or not), only how dense the air-defence network was.

Obviously that fact is far less important if we go with ACLMs, but I still want to get it on the table, and on the record.

And if Coilerburg would sell to pariah states then Astaria would buy every ship.

So a proposal to those who want to get involved in the racing competition. There will be 2 competitions. I'm not sure if there is precedent for one of them, but one of the two competitions is an F-1 race. With the usual rules etc.

The other competition I was thinking of is a standard car competition with the fastest car. I'm not sure if there is precedent for that sort of race, since the other car race I know of involves mostly souped up sedans. Of course, one might argue that the older F-1 races involved cars that are more akin to the modern Ferraris etc.

Sure, Norse. I'm changing the nature of the attack right now to a more limited and pinpoint strike.

Fingolfin_Noldor wrote:So a proposal to those who want to get involved in the racing competition. There will be 2 competitions. I'm not sure if there is precedent for one of them, but one of the two competitions is an F-1 race. With the usual rules etc.

Lets make it 1980s/early 90s rules so we can have 2000hp turbocharged engines. We certainly do not want current 2008 F1 rules or anything from the last five years... they suck. We can keep safety standards up by simply building huge tracks with huge runoffs… cost is not an issue.

The other competition I was thinking of is a standard car competition with the fastest car. I'm not sure if there is precedent for that sort of race, since the other car race I know of involves mostly souped up sedans. Of course, one might argue that the older F-1 races involved cars that are more akin to the modern Ferraris etc.

F-1 has always been open wheel racing as I recall, abet the regulars used to allow way more diversity in design. It sounds like you want a race with closed wheel designs, in which case I suggest something like Le Mans in which both prototypes (limited only by relatively broad technical regulations) and souped up production models race in several classifications on the track at once.

Sea Skimmer wrote:Lets make it 1980s/early 90s rules so we can have 2000hp turbocharged engines. We certainly do not want current 2008 F1 rules or anything from the last five years... they suck. We can keep safety standards up by simply building huge tracks with huge runoffs… cost is not an issue.

Sounds good. I expect your equivalent for Mitsubitshi Heavy Industries to participate. Japanese are heavily involved in engine design for many F-1 cars and there's a Toyota team or Honda team I forgot which. I will be busy getting the track and stands ready come end of the year.

Though why do the rules suck? Too much automation allowed (and getting around the rules)?

F-1 has always been open wheel racing as I recall, abet the regulars used to allow way more diversity in design. It sounds like you want a race with closed wheel designs, in which case I suggest something like Le Mans in which both prototypes (limited only by relatively broad technical regulations) and souped up production models race in several classifications on the track at once.

I remember there were the NASCAR rallies, but the Le Mans, from the way it looks, seems fine.

Now of course I'm assuming that everyone is bringing their own designs that are already prototyped and tested. Of course realistically, it takes a number of years to over a decade to bring up a whole new design.

I'm not really feeling all that better. Still, I'll try to get something written

Okay Norseman, basically, the attack has been modified to make it less heavy and far less discriminate.

Only one Astarian A-50 and MiG-31 was downed (at the point of penetration), and after that my MiG-31Ms ran away, losing 1 Mig-31M to an S-300V battery.

Tu-160s lobbed 100+ Kh-90 - 80 of them indiscriminately in Astaria versus naval facilities, slightly more discriminate in South Veleria - which I agree deserves more blame for this. The CEP would be between 300 and 700m (the Mach 4 missile covers the 500-750 km launching distance very fast, so the inertial guidance error cannot be too great - it's on the order of 0,1-0,2% of launching distance even for slow cruise missiles). Each missile carried 2x 400 kg warheads, which have a destruction area of 1500 m square (a circle around 40 m in diameter) - this means Astaria experienced 240 000 m square in a 500 m CEP (a 500x500m square would equal 250 000 m square), or in other terms, I totally ravaged 2 port facilities of your choice in Astaria and South Veleria. After launching, they turned away likewise.

No Tu-22M5s, Tu-95MS participated in the strike, only Tu-160s.

Five Sukhoi T-4s conducted runs on a 1000 km radius around the Crimson CVBG to kill possible surface combatants, having 10 Kh-45 supersonic AShMs to boot. If there were no combatants, lets say we sunk some patrol boats and that's all.

100+ Kh-90s? Doesn't that .. constitute like 50+ Tu-160?

Yeah. There are 80 Tu-160s participating in the attack. 40 of those fire at Astarian harbor, 40 at the South Velerian harbor. Each release ~80 Kh-90s. I used BETAB-500SHP-type warheads to ensure concrete paving is destroyed on an area of 50 sq. m around each explosion, meaning for the 2x80=160 warheads lobbed at Astaria, the area of concrete destroyed is 8000 m square and same for their port facility in colonial Veleria.

P.S. OTH radars, especially at longer ranges and lower altitudes, are susceptible to jamming since the return is very weak, and all the actual bombing operations were run from around the OTH minimum range, where it's sensitivty is worst. Anyone approaching my CVBG and bomber group, would have to use his own radars for targeting since OTH radars aren't useful for much more than AEW anyway.

Shroom, I should point out that Byzantine Heavy Industry Automotive Division does cars, but mostly for the mass market. Probably more akin to Renault or Mitsubishi.

Maybe I should have added that in, but I didn't feel like finding a pic for it.

We're talking about race cars, so talking about the manufacturers of normal cars would really be inappropriate, since we're talking about the need... the need for speed!

We're pimping our Formula One stuff, so we're showing our super awesome stuff! VROOM!



Anyway, we've also got MacMillan Motors for regular cars and stuff. And Shroomswagen. Volkswagen, man! We got Beetles and Hippie Vans and stuff!

Shroom Man 777 wrote:We're talking about race cars, so talking about the manufacturers of normal cars would really be inappropriate, since we're talking about the need... the need for speed!

We're pimping our Formula One stuff, so we're showing our super awesome stuff! VROOM!



Anyway, we've also got MacMillan Motors for regular cars and stuff. And Shroomswagen. Volkswagen, man! We got Beetles and Hippie Vans and stuff!

Quite a few car manufacturers like Toyota and Renault, and Mazda all make cars for the mass market but they also have the sports car models. Toyota and Renault both have F-1 teams, though the latter has had more success because Renault bought the Benetton team (or so wiki says).

SiegeTank, regarding your... request for tender, what exactly is a standard mission profile? Because if you want to chuck about 40 Rafale-M and a load of other vehicles, you will need something bigger than a .... lengthened Charles De Gaul. Something of the scale of a Brit CTOL CVF carrier.