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RogueIce wrote:Sure, they'll all say it, but in my experience, it's not true.

All the guys I see who act like total assholes are the ones the chicks flock around. You know, the ones who have their hands all over every female in sight, and steal stuff from the girls, and otherwise act like complete and utter jackasses?

Meanwhile, you have the nice guys, who will treat a girl with some dignity, and won't drape themselves all over any convenient female form. And the girls won't show the slightest attraction to them at all (I fall into this group).

I don't get it. I've been talking to Illimunatis about it over AIM, and I figured I might as well put it to the board as a whole.

Anyone else see what's up with this? Seems mostly among the high school and possibly college crowd, by the way.

In one simple word, because they're BORING...for a young girl.

Don't worry after they past 25, they will ignore this kind of boys.

Darth Pounder wrote:I don't know about this thing about being nice = being door mat. i can be a large part of how you carry yourself. Nice guys can be very reserved and that doesn't attract the attention of a Lady. Think to the animal kingdom. What animal gets his hole? Always the animal doing somethign different, loud and noticable.

I know from experience. When I was doing my MCP i fell madly for this girl Suzanne. I was nuts about her, she had curley red hair and blue eyes a man could drown in. At first i chalked it up to physical attraction, i added her to my spank bank and tried not to think of her. Then i got to know her. She was amazing, she loved the bands i loved and she had a similar sence of humor etc. Only problem was a guy i know called Ray also fancied her. Mostly he fancied her to annoy me and prove his superiority. I know it and he knows it. Any way both of us vied for her attention. We socialised in the same groups and flirted like frig with her. Ray is a grade A asshole, he has nothing in common with her yet she picked him. Thats not fair. Why did she pick him?

In that scenario, a little applied force to the jerk would soothe things, provided you can do it discreetly. At the very least it would make you feel better.

Zaia wrote: I'd be willing to bet my life that there are more nice girls out there brokenhearted because of shallow men looking for models than there are nice guys who are lonely because the women they love only go after assholes.

Speaking from experience, I suppose?

Simon H.Johansen wrote:

Zaia wrote: I'd be willing to bet my life that there are more nice girls out there brokenhearted because of shallow men looking for models than there are nice guys who are lonely because the women they love only go after assholes.

Speaking from experience, I suppose?

What gave it away?

Seriously, I don't know what it is, but no matter how attractive guys are, at a certain age, they seem to only be attracted to perfect-looking women. They obviously don't give a damn about what her personality is, because she could roll her eyes, tell him that he's the ugliest motherfucker she's ever seen and that she'd never even let him shake her hand, let alone kiss or screw her, but does that matter? Of course not. He still thinks she's the most gorgeous thing ever.

I have this bizarre thing where, even if a guy looks gorgeous, if he's an asshole, then suddenly he's not attractive anymore, not even physically attractive. His good looks will annoy the piss out of me and I will literally not find ANYTHING attractive about him after I see or hear him be a prick.

Most guys don't appear to be able to do the same thing. Or if they can, they choose not to.

Zaia wrote: I have this bizarre thing where, even if a guy looks gorgeous, if he's an asshole, then suddenly he's not attractive anymore, not even physically attractive. His good looks will annoy the piss out of me and I will literally not find ANYTHING attractive about him after I see or hear him be a prick.

Most guys don't appear to be able to do the same thing. Or if they can, they choose not to.

I think it depends on age/maturity/intelligence. I can think of a number of women who are "attractive" physically, but to who I feel no attraction. Women that act like they can get any guy are a real turn-off for me. I’m looking for someone to spend time with, not necessarily jump through hoops to see if I’m a good entertainment centre.

Zaia wrote:Seriously, I don't know what it is, but no matter how attractive guys are, at a certain age, they seem to only be attracted to perfect-looking women. They obviously don't give a damn about what her personality is, because she could roll her eyes, tell him that he's the ugliest motherfucker she's ever seen and that she'd never even let him shake her hand, let alone kiss or screw her, but does that matter? Of course not. He still thinks she's the most gorgeous thing ever.

They're called hormones. Guys in the range of 15 to 25 tend to go for the looks first, and there's not a whole lot that can be done about it. They're not looking for a person they'll spend the rest of their lives with; they're looking for a good time.

When they reach 30 and are still alone, they'll begin looking for women who would make good wives and mothers, and that's all personality.

In addition to that, you have to consider that society puts a lot of pressure on women to look a certain way. Just look at Cosmo on the shelf next time you're in a grocery store.

I have this bizarre thing where, even if a guy looks gorgeous, if he's an asshole, then suddenly he's not attractive anymore, not even physically attractive. His good looks will annoy the piss out of me and I will literally not find ANYTHING attractive about him after I see or hear him be a prick.

And that's why men are different from women. Granted, men are very capable of hating women, but chances are they won't pass up an opportunity to fuck.

Durandal wrote:They're called hormones. Guys in the range of 15 to 25 tend to go for the looks first, and there's not a whole lot that can be done about it. They're not looking for a person they'll spend the rest of their lives with; they're looking for a good time.

When they reach 30 and are still alone, they'll begin looking for women who would make good wives and mothers, and that's all personality.

I understand that, which is why I put "at a certain age, they seem to only be attracted to perfect-looking women." That doesn't make it any less maddening.

In addition to that, you have to consider that society puts a lot of pressure on women to look a certain way. Just look at Cosmo on the shelf next time you're in a grocery store.

Um, hello, darling, I am one of those women who constantly feels that pressure. It sucks. I'm not physically perfect, and never will be, and society makes me feel like everyone is pointing and laughing and mumbling under their breath that I'm not good enough as I am and that no man will be attracted to me unless I am perfect. I know the reality is that that isn't true, but it feels that way much of the time. It's a sucky way to live life, and it takes a lot of self-confidence and strength to be able to shake that feeling.

And that's why men are different from women. Granted, men are very capable of hating women, but chances are they won't pass up an opportunity to fuck.

Indeed.

Well, at great personal risk to myself, I'll come back into this with my story.

Just so you all know, the girl I am attracted to, who probably thinks of me as a harmless brother, is not physicaly perfect. Yes, she does look attractive (to me, anyway), but she's hardly a Barbie. Nor would most people (other than me in my blind love, of course ) consider her to be the most attractive girl in our former school. So it ain't that.

And, for the record, I used to have those crushes on the girls who go after the assholes, but after about Junior year I lost that. Sure, I'll be friends with them because they're nice and all, but nothing more.

And this new batch who came into my school last year, who go out with a guy, get dumped after awhile and cry about (because they were oh so in love...) it for three days, then are with another guy like nothing ever happened, and are still huggy-kissy and crap with their "ex" (though how they keep them all straight I can't imagine), I would not touch them with a ten-foot pole, under the simple rule of "I don't know where, or in how many places and with how many people, those have been". And to show you just one example: guy is fucking proud to have had seven girlfriends since the school year started, and he made this pronouncment in about January. That's what, five months? And yet, despite this, these moronic girls still go out with him, and they think they're in love, or some crap like that.

If ya wanna get past harmless brother illusion you're going have to talk to her. Because she may harbor this on the simple priciple that you haven't said other wise.

As for strange things in high school, I see it mostly due to cliques. I mean in high school I knew most of them, hung out with them...went to their strange parties where 80% got drunk/stoned/had sex/got drunk some more...all because of who knows. I even dated one chick from the grouping(nice girl...not nearly as bad as other people said she was...and was bitchy to some people because they went by second/third/fourth hand rumors)

While parties were interesting research projects(how fast could one get stoned/drunk/laid in an hour...it goes away)

For the most part learned that later on...women dig confidence more then just simply looks. And partially why chicks dig the *bad boy* is because the bad boy does exude confidence...be it false or otherwise.

Ghost Rider wrote:If ya wanna get past harmless brother illusion you're going have to talk to her. Because she may harbor this on the simple priciple that you haven't said other wise.

I plan on it. Very soon, hopefully.

And Zaia, sorry you feel that way. Just know that, no matter how tough it gets, there will always be Internet Nerd Fanboys on this BBS to worship you.

RogueIce wrote:

Ghost Rider wrote:If ya wanna get past harmless brother illusion you're going have to talk to her. Because she may harbor this on the simple priciple that you haven't said other wise.

I plan on it. Very soon, hopefully.

Good for you. We're not as scary as you may think.

And Zaia, sorry you feel that way. Just know that, no matter how tough it gets, there will always be Internet Nerd Fanboys on this BBS to worship you.

*chuckles and kisses RogueIce's cheek* Thanks, sweetie. It does help a bit.

Zaia wrote:Good for you. We're not as scary as you may think.

You're not??

I must now go process this...

Zaia wrote:*chuckles and kisses RogueIce's cheek* Thanks, sweetie. It does help a bit.

Glad I'm doing my part then. The reward is certainly well worth it.

Zaia wrote:

RogueIce wrote:And Zaia, sorry you feel that way. Just know that, no matter how tough it gets, there will always be Internet Nerd Fanboys on this BBS to worship you.

*chuckles and kisses RogueIce's cheek* Thanks, sweetie. It does help a bit.

/me = Zaia Nerd Fanboy!
*WORSHIPING* "Im' not worthy, I'm not worthy!" *WORSHIPING*

Seriously Zaia, you are really, really cool (at least your online persona is... i dont know you in RL)

Mitth'raw'nuruodo wrote:

Zaia wrote:*chuckles and kisses RogueIce's cheek* Thanks, sweetie. It does help a bit.

/me = Zaia Nerd Fanboy!
*WORSHIPING* "Im' not worthy, I'm not worthy!" *WORSHIPING*

Seriously Zaia, you are really, really cool (at least your online persona is... i dont know you in RL)

LOL

Thanks, babe. That's sweet of you to say, since my online persona is basically exactly the same as I am in real life. The only difference is that I am slightly more confident here. *blows kiss to Mitth'raw'nuruodo* But only just slightly.

Zaia wrote:LOL

Thanks, babe. That's sweet of you to say, since my online persona is basically exactly the same as I am in real life. The only difference is that I am slightly more confident here. *blows kiss to Mitth'raw'nuruodo* But only just slightly.

Only slightly? *thinks about it*

I'll make you a deal: if I ever meet you in real life, I will have absolutely no trouble with you kissing me on the cheek, nose, or other area, nor will I harbor any ill will towards you if you were to blow kisses my way and hug me.

Deal?

Laird wrote:Women like a guy whos in charge,nice guys just don't have it in them to be "In charge".

That's what I like to call the bad Guy nice Guy fallacy. That fact is that the female's vision of a bad guy doesn't exist. Bad a guy plain and simple is a Bad guy, they willl cheat, rape, abuse you. On the other hand not all nice guys spineless man-ginas.

Zaia wrote: Good for you. We're not as scary as you may think.

Speak fro yourself *cracks whip*

innerbrat wrote:

Zaia wrote: Good for you. We're not as scary as you may think.

Speak fro yourself *cracks whip*

Didn't read every post in the thread, so forgive me if I'm repeating something someone else has said.

Basically, you're looking at the wrong element. It's not that girls and young women are attracted to assholes, it's that women (and non-insecure men) are attracted to confidence, and who projects more confidence than an insecure asshole with something to prove? It's false confidence, of course, and those guys are ironically the least confident people on the planet. Intelligent women can see it for what it is, while girls and dumb ones can't. In high school, it's just tough. The sad truth is that the good guys get passed over, but once you graduate, you get sweet, sweet revenge when the world turns upside down, and all the dumb jocks end up with dumb bimbos just as unworthy as they are, and all (well, most) of the guys who got passed over undeservedly end up needing a stick to keep all the female attention back.

I know high school and being a teenager sucks. It was the worst period of my life by massive orders of magnitude, that's for sure, but once it's over, things change, and they change fast. Just tough it out.

And to show you just one example: guy is fucking proud to have had seven girlfriends since the school year started, and he made this pronouncment in about January. That's what, five months? And yet, despite this, these moronic girls still go out with him, and they think they're in love, or some crap like that

Heh, one of my friends is exactly like that. He's had probably about the same amount of relationships this year, along with making out with 11 different people in 3 days, two of which already have boyfriends. Its almost sickening.

Zaia wrote:

Simon H.Johansen wrote:

Zaia wrote: I'd be willing to bet my life that there are more nice girls out there brokenhearted because of shallow men looking for models than there are nice guys who are lonely because the women they love only go after assholes.

Speaking from experience, I suppose?

What gave it away?

Seriously, I don't know what it is, but no matter how attractive guys are, at a certain age, they seem to only be attracted to perfect-looking women. They obviously don't give a damn about what her personality is, because she could roll her eyes, tell him that he's the ugliest motherfucker she's ever seen and that she'd never even let him shake her hand, let alone kiss or screw her, but does that matter? Of course not. He still thinks she's the most gorgeous thing ever.

I have this bizarre thing where, even if a guy looks gorgeous, if he's an asshole, then suddenly he's not attractive anymore, not even physically attractive. His good looks will annoy the piss out of me and I will literally not find ANYTHING attractive about him after I see or hear him be a prick.

Most guys don't appear to be able to do the same thing. Or if they can, they choose not to.

--The reason for this is that around half of men have an IQ below 100 (i.e., they're complete idiots). To compound that problem one can never take a woman's words at face value. In fact, a woman's words may bear no resembalance at all to what she is willing to go along with (ahhh, the perils of playing mind games). Even worse many men use the simple strategy of being obscenely stubborn and not accepting defeat which tends to work quite well. Besides, when was the last time a woman rewarded a man for not being a stubborn bastard (i.e., being a nice guy).

Ive found that being nice gets you nowhere. I was single the entire time i was trying to be nice to people until one day i decided to change. For two years i choose to be a bitch ... i wasn't without a girlfriend for a year and a half. I thought hrmm, maybe it was just a period of time i was going through. I went back to being a nice guy. I haven't had a girlfriend since ... interesting ..... -_-

Ok, y'all, riddle me this:

Why is it that I grew out of my loving-assholes stage (yes, I had a thing for arrogant, egotistical, selfish trumpet players for many, many years) to finally find a genuinely sweet, caring, empathetic, thoughtful, NICE GUY (please refer to my confusion thread about Brian for complete details) with whom I promptly fall in love, who is attracted to me, but who refuses to date me because he was so completely emotionally scarred by his last girlfriend, who was a grade-A bitch who bossed him around and henpecked him to death that now he's terrified of being a fuck-up for the rest of his life because of the things she did and said to him. He's afraid he'd hurt me and chase me out of his life, so we're just going to be friends and hang out now, because he's convinced that he'll drive me to do the same things that this psycho-bitch-from-Hell chick did to him, and he says he cares about me too much to do that to me.

So, an actual nice guy meets an actual nice girl (yes, I really am), and they are attracted to each other, but because normal people don't know how to treat nice people like Brian and me, we've both got so much goddamn baggage it'll be a miracle if we ever so much as kiss.

Zaia wrote:Seriously, I don't know what it is, but no matter how attractive guys are, at a certain age, they seem to only be attracted to perfect-looking women. They obviously don't give a damn about what her personality is, because she could roll her eyes, tell him that he's the ugliest motherfucker she's ever seen and that she'd never even let him shake her hand, let alone kiss or screw her, but does that matter? Of course not. He still thinks she's the most gorgeous thing ever.

I have this bizarre thing where, even if a guy looks gorgeous, if he's an asshole, then suddenly he's not attractive anymore, not even physically attractive. His good looks will annoy the piss out of me and I will literally not find ANYTHING attractive about him after I see or hear him be a prick.

Most guys don't appear to be able to do the same thing. Or if they can, they choose not to.

This is actually strange.

In my personal experience, I know a lot more guys with average and simply cute girls, than girls who are with guys that all the girls find gorgeous.

My friend Kathryn has such a long list of requirements some of them are self-contradictory.

Most girls I know have very high physical standards. Though I'm thinking it could also be a fluke. Afterall, the Air Force guys my girlfriend's older sister hangs around with are the greatest assholes I've ever met (naturally they all want to get into the pants of my 17-year-old girlfriend)--and these guys are your typical tactless selfish pricks who care about getting laid and nothing but with attractive girls (regardless if they are 5 or 6 years younger and jailbait).

So I really don't think it is male or female specific. I've known a lot of manipulative women who are just users who lead you on.

I understand what you're talking about.

I find a girl I think is attractive (and I generally scope the crowd--there's all types and manners and flavors of attractive girls--types are for picky guys who have some to deny themselves)...then you see if the girl is tolerable for over five minutes (and that is really hard right there, much less a girl who you find psychologically alluring). I've lost count of the number of girls I've met with garbage for personalities. Of course, I'm very picky about people's personalities: I think 80% of the population I see on a regular basis are complete morons.

Zaia wrote:Why is it that I grew out of my loving-assholes stage (yes, I had a thing for arrogant, egotistical, selfish trumpet players for many, many years) to finally find a genuinely sweet, caring, empathetic, thoughtful, NICE GUY (please refer to my confusion thread about Brian for complete details) with whom I promptly fall in love, who is attracted to me, but who refuses to date me because he was so completely emotionally scarred by his last girlfriend, who was a grade-A bitch who bossed him around and henpecked him to death that now he's terrified of being a fuck-up for the rest of his life because of the things she did and said to him. He's afraid he'd hurt me and chase me out of his life, so we're just going to be friends and hang out now, because he's convinced that he'll drive me to do the same things that this psycho-bitch-from-Hell chick did to him, and he says he cares about me too much to do that to me.

So, an actual nice guy meets an actual nice girl (yes, I really am), and they are attracted to each other, but because normal people don't know how to treat nice people like Brian and me, we've both got so much goddamn baggage it'll be a miracle if we ever so much as kiss.

Odd mental baggage...

I cannot comment on your side...since I'm not a woman to start off.

But for guys sometimes seriously when one gets out of bad relationship...you really, really, really don't know how to approach any relationship because the last one you were in you thought you did everything right, and apparently you were wrong. Sometimes this hits some people harder then others, I speak from some experience, given how I felt around my last year of college.

It does hit one at the proverbial core of the being, and gnaws at you, sometimes to the point...it'll screw you over when you're in a good relationship because well you don't know it until said person leaves(not saying you do...but once again my experience of what happened to me)

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