Ground combat

[harbringer]

Ok. Slightly off topic but since it can help with the assesment of clone troopers. The anzacs lost crete for four reasons, 1) their communications were via feild telephone and the wires got cut 2) the only tanks on the island were matilda mk1's no match for the panzers landed once the para's seized an airhead 3) they had to defend an island with very few troops. And I might point out my g/f would say the germans probably deserved the casualties .

If the clones had roughly the same skill (in some cases less than 10 fallschirmjager survived the drop let alone being on the ground). Then it is little wonder that the republic won the civil war and would have a huge advantage in a ground campaign in the AQ.

[Stuart Mackey]

Ok. Slightly off topic but since it can help with the assesment of clone troopers. The anzacs lost crete for four reasons, 1) their communications were via feild telephone and the wires got cut 2) the only tanks on the island were matilda mk1's no match for the panzers landed once the para's seized an airhead 3) they had to defend an island with very few troops. And I might point out my g/f would say the germans probably deserved the casualties .

It was a mixed force, dominated by Kiwi's, but included Greeks and Brits.
The tanks were irrelivant, they broke down and the Kruats could not land any. Allied forces also lacked decent arty.

If the clones had roughly the same skill (in some cases less than 10 fallschirmjager survived the drop let alone being on the ground). Then it is little wonder that the republic won the civil war and would have a huge advantage in a ground campaign in the AQ.

Indeed.

[harbringer]

There were a lot of crete militia though brave, were not equiped for the war they faced. The main fighting forces were the kiwi's and Australians (particulary around prison valley) and the kiwi's had a number of 25 pdrs adequate since crete is not a very large Island.

and in mr eds words a tank is a tank of course and no one should argue with a tank of course . Hitler made sure tanks were landed but too late to make any difference to the campaign wich was the grave of the fallschirmjager.

However the Maori and the kiwi's in general were VERY good shots.

In essence good infantry be they clones of jango fett or stormtroopers (who im pretty sure are not <due to the voices involved>) or any nation successfull in war since time began for the human race. Win wars and battles. Tanks and armour can take ground, artillery can pummel it but infantry hold it. Infantry without support will achieve little but good infantry supported well make a victory. And that is why the AQ would fall in the end.

[Sea Skimmer]

Ok. Slightly off topic but since it can help with the assesment of clone troopers. The anzacs lost crete for four reasons, 1) their communications were via feild telephone and the wires got cut

Only late in the battle when all was lost anyway

2) the only tanks on the island were matilda mk1's no match for the panzers landed once the para's seized an airhead

No German armor was landed at all (the ships carrying the tanks where destroyed by the RN), and the Allied forces, ANZAC's made up around half the defenders, had about twenty five Matilda II's and vairous light and early cruiser model tanks.

3) they had to defend an island with very few troops. And I might point out my g/f would say the germans probably deserved the casualties .

Actually allied troops on the island considerably outnumbered the invaders, one German reigment landed ontop of over 15,000 New Zealand troops, who where heavily entrenched.

If the clones had roughly the same skill (in some cases less than 10 fallschirmjager survived the drop let alone being on the ground).

In the case of indviudal aircraft and gliders that might be true, but while the airborne forces suffered heavily they didn't have anything like 90% dead.

The Germans succeeded in Operation Merkur because they had an overwhelming advantage in the air, allied forces where short of all forms of weapons and ammunition, and because they where willing to die in large numbers to directly seize the airfields, allowing for follow-up forces to be rapidly air landed. Had the allies had sufficent weapons and ammuntion, the island could not have been taken by the airborne landings. Though it would have soon been starved and bombed into submission, and with the Royal Navy driven away a primarly seaborne invasion could have be mounted without being sunk. Though by then an evacuation would have been well underway anyway.

[Stuart Mackey]

Ok. Slightly off topic but since it can help with the assesment of clone troopers. The anzacs lost crete for four reasons, 1) their communications were via feild telephone and the wires got cut

Only late in the battle when all was lost anyway

.

Comms were fuked up almost from the get go of the serious fighting around Maleme and led to the loss of the aerodrome and thus the Island. Then there was the long retreat.
As I said, mind, they could not have held Crete even if they had won at Maleme.

[harbringer]

There were only 15,000 kiwis in one place if they were all together as all the anzac units had previously been in greece most were understrength. The heavy slow matilda tanks could not effectively be brought to battle and most of the troops on the island were guarding against a seaborne invasion. As captured weapons were used most units had no actual problem with ammunition untill late in the campaign (when they were being lifted off by destroyer). Tanks were landed in the last week to assist the mountain troops. The german troops performed badly during combat at night. The breakthrough in the campaign was made due to NZ troops mistakenly pulling back.

http://www.diggerhistory.info/pages-nz/ ... ef-ww2.htm
(A unit website written by someone that was actually there.)
http://riv.co.nz/rnza/tales/dyson1.htm
(A brief overveiw by a senior commander)

As an aside even if I was wrong noneof it invalidates my comments in referance to the parralels with sci fi combat.