StarDestroyer.Net BBS

I'm not sure if I want to spend all day searching for the ideal dreadnaught design (though the American and British designs are nice and ideal in general, and some French), and then indulge in countless penny counting just to figure how many damn battleships my economy can support, or whether my colonies are producing enough resources to support my navy.

Some would argue that the current version is the same thing, but with SSGNs. And we could certainly just build a point system that works.

Master_Baerne wrote:Some would argue that the current version is the same thing, but with SSGNs. And we could certainly just build a point system that works.

Well, in that case we aren't aiming for realism anymore.

Realism in things like budgets and economies should only be taken so far, in my humble opinion.

"Accounting Tycoon" and "Tetris for Engineering Majors" are, indeed, no fun at all. The last thing I'd ever want to see is a number-crunching game. I'm more interested in the literary potential-- good characters and political plots, with budgets being bare-bones and "accurate enough" for realistic consistency.

Coyote wrote:I'd be up for anything from the 1870's up to the 1940's. Or, barring that, a version where space flight within the solar system is just beginning to get 'routine'.

I figured we'd sort of transplant our current nations into the new map as closely as possible in terms of size, population, and assets, but completely change the location of everything and either add in a bunch of NPCs or have untamed wilderness ala Frequesue. Think of it as Q dicking around with us again.

Aside from that, however, we'd just keep going, regardless of who makes it to the moon first. I mean really, that's where it gets most interesting.

If we end up subsituting believability for realism in order to do that, that's cool with me. Hell, I'm already doing that.

Feh...I'd really like a "50 years have passed since the first moon landing..." kind of setting, with spaceflight and exploration of the solar system and pioneership in space...

But then again, i'm a hopeless geek in those matters

The only way I see the game "ending" is if we destroy all civilization as we know it or unite all of humanity under a world government. In the former case we can still have a separate RP that focuses on the survivors of the apocalypse and in the latter case we could even theoretically keep playing, since any political organization that large is going to have factions.

I figured the end goal would be to build an interstellar starship and/or contact Earth

PeZook wrote:Feh...I'd really like a "50 years have passed since the first moon landing..." kind of setting, with spaceflight and exploration of the solar system and pioneership in space...

But then again, i'm a hopeless geek in those matters

Hard scifi would be even more annoying than "am I building too many carriers?" at least for me.

Master_Baerne wrote:Realism in things like budgets and economies should only be taken so far, in my humble opinion.

Indeed. Points are simply easier than the Skimmer/Shep method, even if less realistic. Though if we did do it again we'd definately have to be firm about "points or don't play" otherwise we'd probably wind up with an imbalance again.

I have to admit, I didn't think we would last this long, I don't think anybody did. I guess things changed when we killed Shep. There was noone left to provoke a nuclear war, and bring things to an end. But I have to say, the game is quite fun right now and it still has a lot of potential. We shouldn't let it die, we've worked too hard to get here, there have been so many accomplishments, so many good stories...and there is still a lot of stuff left to do.

I want to build a soviet moon base, goddamn it.

As it turns out, my point system was way too stingy. If you followed the points as I established them, you ended up under-militarized. However, that is easily solved by simply halving the point costs per unit (or, conversely, double how much you get per expenditure).

A good 'tonnage by points' and build time calc for ships would be a gold standard, too.

DarthShady wrote:I have to admit, I didn't think we would last this long, I don't think anybody did. I guess things changed when we killed Shep. There was noone left to provoke a nuclear war, and bring things to an end. But I have to say, the game is quite fun right now and it still has a lot of potential. We shouldn't let it die, we've worked too hard to get here, there have been so many accomplishments, so many good stories...and there is still a lot of stuff left to do.

I want to build a soviet moon base, goddamn it.

Hw realistic is that, in a reasonable time frame? I'm guessing not very, unless we somehow go on for another ten months (aka a decade) or so, and that may be too generous.

I mean, it's been 40 years since the USA went to the moon, and there are no moonbases yet. Yeah yeah, political will and all that, but...where is the driving urge for one here, anyway? Besides "leaders think it'd be cool" which is nice, but doesn't get you budgets. Unless you get very autocratic.

And hell, we're not even at our moon yet. With maybe what, four to five years or actual manned spaceflight experience at best? I'd say moonbases, or long-term space habitation is...quite a long ways away. Unless we just pull technology and knowledge out of out ass, any pretense at realism be damned.

DarthShady wrote:I have to admit, I didn't think we would last this long, I don't think anybody did. I guess things changed when wekilled Shep. There was noone left to provoke a nuclear war, and bring things to an end. But I have to say, the game is quite fun right now and it still has a lot of potential. We shouldn't let it die, we've worked too hard to get here, there have been so many accomplishments, so many good stories...and there is still a lot of stuff left to do.

I want to build a soviet moon base, goddamn it.

Oh-ho-ho.

RogueIce wrote: Hw realistic is that, in a reasonable time frame? I'm guessing not very, unless we somehow go on for another ten months (aka a decade) or so, and that may be too generous.

I mean, it's been 40 years since the USA went to the moon, and there are no moonbases yet. Yeah yeah, political will and all that, but...where is the driving urge for one here, anyway? Besides "leaders think it'd be cool" which is nice, but doesn't get you budgets. Unless you get very autocratic.

And hell, we're not even at our moon yet. With maybe what, four to five years or actual manned spaceflight experience at best? I'd say moonbases, or long-term space habitation is...quite a long ways away. Unless we just pull technology and knowledge out of out ass, any pretense at realism be damned.

I never said it was realistic. I was thinking more along the lines of, it would be fun to actually get there; to colonize the moon. But you're right, we probably won't last that long. Still, it would be an awesome thing.

Lonestar wrote:Oh-ho-ho.

Correction, You and Stas killed Shep.

I'd say not only tweak the point system but also end the concept of "point caps". Instead of a nation being given a hard limit at its power level (like Tsardoms getting 1500 points, Kingdoms getting 750), make it where points are determined by GDP and the percentage the player wants to spend on defense. A player with a GDP of a trillion who puts a tenth of his GDP into defense would get, say, 1,000 points, while another who only has seven percent in GDP would get 700 points.

1920 is a nice start point, maybe 1930 at the latest. Aircraft are just coming into being, along with aircraft carriers. Battleships are starting to drift toward 40,000 tons. Early tanks and armored motor vehicles are promising mobility to ground troops unmatched in history. Radio is in its infancy. Etc.

Let's play this game a bit longer, though, since no one's made the moon shots yet and there might yet be some interesting things to do. If we end it voluntarily I think we should do it this June or something when we've hit a decade in-game (And IIRC the timing has moon shots being around that time anyway) where Q declares we've "won" and we get to live happily ever after. Or something like that.

And then when SDN World Mark III comes along, we just hit the reset button on our avatars. Completely new ones instead of the complex baggage of having our lives yanked out from under us again. After all, Q's impish but not cruel.

As for this game, I really think we're too far in to add another big continent with NPCs. Let's just do a better job next game and use Earth as a basis (though we don't necessarily need to completely use it, for instance Shroom here could replace the British Isles with Usea to be Shroomania if he wanted).

DarthShady wrote: Correction, You and Stas killed Shep.

Shep is alive and well, and will be making a return. I've yet to decide whether or not it will be as a NPC or as player(since I don't think Shep actually quit)

I'm a bit confused. What do you mean, Shep's coming back?

Master_Baerne wrote:I'm a bit confused. What do you mean, Shep's coming back?

Dude is alive(remember, he was pulled from a bunker).

IIRC correctly Shep was found alive by OD troops in a bunker somewhere in Shepistan.

And Lonestar, wouldn't it kinda be up to Shep if he wants back in the game? I mean you could roleplay him as an an NPC, but if Shep(The real Shep) wants back in the game, he would have to start out with a new nation.

DarthShady wrote:IIRC correctly Shep was found alive by OD troops in a bunker somewhere in Shepistan.

And Lonestar, wouldn't it kinda be up to Shep if he wants back in the game? I mean you could roleplay him as an an NPC, but if Shep(The real Shep) wants back in the game, he would have to start out with a new nation.

Shep has actually bounced a couple of ideas off me in the past as a way for him to return. None of them involve new nations.

Ah. Thanks for the explanation.

Lonestar wrote: Shep has actually bounced a couple of ideas off me in the past as a way for him to return. None of them involve new nations.

Ah...something more devious then?

A moon base is actually closer than most people think: with superheavy boosters ready to enter service, building one will be almost trivial. An Ares or Vulkan booster could deliver an entire fully equipped habitat module, with a second launch carrying the powerplant, and a smaller rocket with the crew. Five years of intense construction and you can have a permenent presence firmly established.

Man you assholes cannot design soldier kits. I also like how Zor was able to pull a new design out of his ass so quickly