Battlestar Galactica - RAZOR Airs Tonight...

[Spanky The Dolphin]

There was already sort of a thread about this movie due to the fact that it got leaked, but I figured it deserved an "official" discussion thread when it actually aired, for those who decided to avoid early spoilers.

Anyway, the movie is airing on Sci Fi in about an hour and a half; 9:00 PM EST/8:00 CST.

(This OP could have been better if I wasn't so rushed...)

[Gil Hamilton]

Huh, that was a crazy segue to commercial.

Sci-Fi Guy voice over "It's been revealed that Gina Perez and Helena Cain are lovers... Quiznos. Mmm-mmm-mmm-mmm-mmm. Toasty."

[Brother-Captain Gaius]

Bwahaha, lovers. I find that hilarious for some reason.

And so far I'm just getting peeved off more over what they did to Fisk. He's such a badass, or at least he ought to be.

[Gil Hamilton]

Ah... that's the stuff. "By your command."

[Agent Fisher]

So, the Hybrid believes Starbuck to be evil. Hmmmm.

[Brother-Captain Gaius]

Ah... that's the stuff. "By your command."

That had me in fucking tears.

I mean I heard rumors they were slipping in some old school stuff, but goddamn...

[Lonestar]

Should be interesting. Now, did that Hybrid really think he was God?

[Gil Hamilton]

Oh for the love of Lorne Greene, more of Kara Thrace and Her Special Destiny? Not just awesome sports player, best pilot in the fleet, sniper, boxer, crazy psychic, and now Horseman of the Fucking Apocalypse? That's so super awesome! *mimes hand pistol to head and makes a bang noise*

And aside that why did they take off their space suits when they boarding the ship? And Shaw shooting the guy the Centurion was dragging rather than the Centurion was so overdone. We get it, Shaw is Cain Part 2.

Other than that, I really liked the movie, the end aside. It was good to sum up what happened with the Pegasus. My big criticism (aside from it doing more Starbuck wank) is I think Cain when into Psychotic Murder Mode too abruptly, to the point I think their should have been a cartoon snapping noise before she shot her XO. It's one thing to make a serious of compromises until one day you find yourself a monster, but she went straight from saying at dinner that they can't compromise who they are to ordering a near suicidal attack and shooting her XO on the bridge with no intermediary step. That wasn't a moral descent, that was tripping off a cliff. It also reinforces my thought that she really had it coming when Gina evacuated her skull. So goes Admiral Helena Cain, murderer and traitor.

That said, I really liked the old school Cylons being around. The old Centurion were slick (somewhat slicker than the new models and it seems just as tough). Makes you wonder why they decided to scrap them. That's a story they could go into, if the new model fleshy Cylons and old style Cylons had a falling out and why. I'd like to explore that more than Kara Thrace: Mary Sue Wonderchild.

[CaptJodan]

Loved seeing the old Cylons and "By your Command". Granted, I loathe the old series, but despite that, I enjoyed them incorporating it into the new the way they did.

Gina and Cain lovers...well it certainly explains a lot.

Starbuck's destiny to potentially doom the fleet. I'm all for it. The Mary Sue that turns out to be trying to kill everyone off. Better that then her actually being the key to their eventual salvation.

It was wonderful to see Pegasus in action again. Galactica hasn't been in any major battles since Exodus, and you can't really blame her, and it was good to see that ship fighting again. It must certainly have had a really good production facility aboard in order to repair the ship from all the battle damage she took over the long haul.

Overall, I gave it a 5. I felt it was a pretty strong piece.

[Durandal]

I saw it in a movie theatre in Santana Row a couple weeks ago and thought it was fantastic. Not much more I can say about it.

[CaptJodan]

Oh for the love of Lorne Greene, more of Kara Thrace and Her Special Destiny? Not just awesome sports player, best pilot in the fleet, sniper, boxer, crazy psychic, and now Horseman of the Fucking Apocalypse? That's so super awesome! *mimes hand pistol to head and makes a bang noise*

Even Vader had a lot of talents and a destiny.

At this point, I take her more as a...not a villian exactly, but in that general spirit. You often times have villians that are just "super awesome" at what they do until the underdog goodguy comes to school them. Kara doesn't exactly fit that mold, because I imagine she actually believes what she says and will likely not be played out as a complete badguy (though I'm just guessing here, I have no knowledge of spoilers). Still, the fact that she:
1. Had a destiny to begin with
2. Got killed prior to us seeing this destiny, thus making SOME of us wonder WTF.
3. ...and finally came back to life
Was already too much for me. Her claims were already beyond outlandish at the end of last season, and if those claims she made were true, I think it would have been worse than this. So I feel this is slightly better, if only now she's someone to work against.

[Skylon]

Oh for the love of Lorne Greene, more of Kara Thrace and Her Special Destiny? Not just awesome sports player, best pilot in the fleet, sniper, boxer, crazy psychic, and now Horseman of the Fucking Apocalypse? That's so super awesome! *mimes hand pistol to head and makes a bang noise*

Well, seeing as we are stuck with "Kara's Destiny" (like it or not), and have been since season 1, I think it's a good call by the writers to throw that seed at the audience that her destiny may not be all its cracked up to be (hopefully this ain't a red-herring either). Especially after her miracle return last season.

I'd like to explore that more than Kara Thrace: Mary Sue Wonderchild.

That says something rather odd about Ron Moore if Starbuck's supposed to be his Mary Sue.

[Aenigma]

Good movie. It's also rather sad that the actor playing hot Asian protegee of Admiral Kain managed to have better character development, and more emotional impact, in a single 2 hour special then Katee Sackhoff has managed in three seasons.

[Macross]

Yay! A Gold Centurion! I really want to see more of the old Cylons and the old style Raiders.

[Darwin]

I saw it in a movie theatre in Santana Row a couple weeks ago and thought it was fantastic. Not much more I can say about it.

Hay, I was there! I went to the late showing.

[Spanky The Dolphin]

The sight of talking old Centurions has made me content enough that I'll shut up about the new ones not talking.

Overall, I thought it was very good, though it seems just a little too short in places (that's probably what the DVD is for, but I don't expect very much to be expanded or added,) which effects the story and pacing a little. I give it a good solid four.

[LadyTevar]

The old boomarang Raiders. Silver Centurians, with a Gold in the Captain's seat. That flat robotic voice. And the reply "By Your Command".

And better yet, the boomarangs were flying better than before, with that wicked thruster-flip the one did. The CGI was obvious CGI to me, since they had the Centurians moving far more 'humanly'. That threw me off ... but I want to go back and see it again, just to look at them move and fire. And, as Nitram pointed out, WOW! They're using Cover! They're using TACTICS!

4/5 for me.

[Darwin]

The sight of talking old Centurions has made me content enough that I'll shut up about the new ones not talking.

Overall, I thought it was very good, though it seems just a little too short in places (that's probably what the DVD is for, but I don't expect very much to be expanded or added,) which effects the story and pacing a little. I give it a good solid four.

The DVD release will included an extended Adama flashback, going from just before fighters are scrambled to his ejection and ending up at the cylon hybrid facility, basically including all the 'razor flashback' content. I expect additional extended scenes as well.

[Coalition]

The DVD release will included an extended Adama flashback, going from just before fighters are scrambled to his ejection and ending up at the cylon hybrid facility, basically including all the 'razor flashback' content. I expect additional extended scenes as well.

Saw it with a couple friends, it didn't seem that good as I had been hoping for.

For combat, it looked like the older Raiders were heavier models, capable of taking more punishment than the newer integrated models. The Raptor stunt was a bit risky, as if the Cylons had fired a missile, they would have been dead (and I'm surprised they weren't from the Raptor blowing up and holing a suit). I can see the suits being left behind, as if they get into combat, and bullets are flying, an arm wound is survivable, but a hole in the space suit is not recommended.

Still, you'd expect the Cylon AI to notice something like an airlock opening, or to station guards at the openings. No need for as many damage control parties as the Battlestar is moving away, so release a few troops to play alarm.

But yes, the lieutenant was a nice character, and did raise a few good points. She saw what appeared to be nepotism, where Daddy hands the son the keys to the Battlestar, and the son puts his shag-partner in charge of the flight operations. Then she gets called in and made XO. It would have been nice to see more of her, but it would have interfered with the main story too much.

I did joke about that extended content being more Cain/Gina fun.

[JME2]

My oh my, it's been what? Seven months since our last glimpse of the struggle of hummanity's future? Well, my roommie and I celebrated by popping out the old bottle of scotch (Our running gag of "Battlescotch Galactica" lives again and will continue until the day the show ends) and turned on the television.

My thoughts on Razor: Not perfect, but a great alternate look at the events of "Pegasus" and Cain. And of course, we have set-up for elements that will presumably come into play in the final season. As I said, it wasn't perfect, but good and I can't wait until March comes along.

4/5

[DrMckay]

minor gripes-

1)Cain going off the deep end too quickly-shooting Belzen (seriously, does steve bacic have to get killed in every guest role in existence?) I think the mission should have been slightly more winnable, adn made his call more questionable, forcing Cain to make a tough call then, having that call be when she steps over the edge.

Seems like she was already over it.

2)Gina was tortured for information. not that I'm a sadist or anything, but some information "gleaned" from her would have been nice. Just for continuity. In Resurrection ship Pt. I, one of the Marines beating Tyrol and Helo in their cells mentioned that Thorne had saved many lives. including Fiske's. A one minute spot on information gleaned and "lives saved by it" would add another layer to the story.

3) Cain's immediate decision to strip the civilian ships. Some dialogue about-we have no war supplies or spare _________'s would have been nice. Perhaps Pegasus could have intervened when the Cylons were attacking the Civvies. (who, according to Fiske, were armed.) a multidfimensional battle.

4) Laird. Love the Character, but they should have highlighted him with his family, showing him as a leader forced into it for their sake. No one protested the Marines by saying "The Military exists to protect and defend civilians. Do your jobs." to cause controversy.

5) the fact that the episode ended on Galactica. What was this movie about? I thought it was the redemption of Pegasus?

What I liked:

1)The attack, as seen from Shaw's POV. It was like watching standard Star Trek or military SF, the established cameraderie between the high ranks, on a high tech, functioning ship, the relaxed smiles, then *WHAM*

2) Shaw. Her whole character and journey. Miles more watchable than "Kara Thrace and her Special Destiny." Her acting really sold me, especially her tiredness, at the end. (good eye candy too...)

3) the battles. the battles the battles. Wow.

4) the old cylons.

5) Lee acting like a commander, and using his brain.

4) Adama admitting to his Lee that he has been a moral compass for him.

good show chaps, good show.

[Zor]

It was rather well done. Did a good deal to flesh out Pegasus. Personally i liked the way they did the old toasters, as well as their toys (praticularly their SMGs, original design that does not have horrible ergenomics and with good asthetics). Never-the-less, i still want to see the Cylons on their home turf.

That and Kendra Shaw was dead sexy.

Zor

[Alan Bolte]

Some dialogue about-we have no war supplies or spare _________'s would have been nice.

There was at least a little of that. Enough, I think, but easy to miss. I agree with the rest of the gripes here, though.

[Gil Hamilton]

I think that's the thing, DrMckay. Razor wasn't really about the redemption of Pegasus or anyone on it. Razor made it very clear that there was nothing redeeming about Cain or what they did.

Later, they kept talking about how Cain or Thorne saved their lives and if it weren't them, they wouldn't have survived. However, Razor makes it clear that is just something they were telling themselves, and Cain's actions didn't save a single one of them.

It was a complete fluke that Pegasus wasn't destroyed while still moored to the shipyard, because for some reason the Cylons opted to not bomb it as heavily as they did the shipyard structure itself.

Attacking the communications relay turned out to be completely pointless and an unnecessary waste of men, demonstrating she was off the deep end, since Belzen stated all this. This scene also makes Fisk somewhat of a coward. He watched Cain waste Belzen in an attempt to save them from Cain being a psycho and ended up being her dog anyway.

Stripping those civilian ships and ordering the murders of the families of the people they were impressing into service accomplished... what for them? There weren't that many people on those ships and (thanks to Cain) nearly a third of the Pegasus' crew was dead. They were bound to have supplies enough for everyone there, even if they had to take them with them due to desperately needing parts from their ships. But, no, that wouldn't fit into the whole "Suicide by Cylon" thing Cain had going, so instead all the civilians except for the ones force to work were left to die in space.

Finally, Gina. So it was revenge, huh? Still didn't save anyones lives, nor did Thorne by what Cain, Thorne, and much of the crew did to her.

In other words, if this movie was trying to redeem the Pegasus, it was a stunning failure, it only proved that the ship was full of murderers, psychos, and cowards. Kind of puts paid completely to Starbuck's speech at her funeral entire. No, you weren't safer with Cain around. Cain would have spent your lives like bullets out of madness and would have killed off the last remnants of humanity without caring in order to even get some pointless amount of damage on the Cylons. That should have been her epitaph.

[Zac Naloen]

Where was it stated the movie as a redemption of Pegasus?

I don't recall ever reading that beyond people assumptions.