Terminator: Could Cameron have a baby?

[Shrykull]

If she has ovaries with eggs and a uterus, why not? Though, I suspect they would have omitted these organs as Skyney wouldn't need for her to reproduce, for any reason.

[Singular Intellect]

Why is this even a question?

It's a bit like asking if a toaster could have one. She looks human and can act enough like a human to fool most. Other than her ability to seemingly east food, she doesn't strike me as that radically different and is just another cyborg.

(Like I jokingly told my brother, I think the Cameron model can only consume food because swallowing was something the humans cooked up for such a sexy model of Terminator. )

[ray245]

In the terminator novels and etc, there was a model that can reproduce if I remember...but I'm not sure which book.

[weemadando]

That would be the human model. The one that was a human with some implants.

Cameron however has a big fat alloy actuator where her uterus would be. So I doubt she could have any babies.



Do you see?

I mean, if you really wanted, you could put a uterus there - but without the MASSIVE AMOUNTS of other internal plumbing required to have a fetus on life support for 9 months I don't think it's really going to work that well.

And after all, it's only a sheath of flesh and skin to allow deception - not a fully working body.

[weemadando]

The I-950 is what I'm thinking of. Are you?

[Shrykull]

Why is this even a question?

It's a bit like asking if a toaster could have one. She looks human and can act enough like a human to fool most. Other than her ability to seemingly east food, she doesn't strike me as that radically different and is just another cyborg.

I don't quite get your point. I said if she has all the hardware (biological in this case she could. A toaster could have one? A toaster can toast toast, but not make another toaster. Are you agreeing with me or not?

[Shrykull]

That would be the human model. The one that was a human with some implants.

Cameron however has a big fat alloy actuator where her uterus would be. So I doubt she could have any babies.

What about an ectopic pregnancy then? Actually, even a man could have a baby if you transplanted the fertilized egg into the wall of his abdominal cavity.

Do you see?

I mean, if you really wanted, you could put a uterus there - but without the MASSIVE AMOUNTS of other internal plumbing required to have a fetus on life support for 9 months I don't think it's really going to work that well.

And after all, it's only a sheath of flesh and skin to allow deception - not a fully working body.

No, it's fully functioning, think about all the systems she needs, if she ingests food, she'll need a digestive system. And their skin does heal, so you need a circulatory system to get it there, which means she needs kidneys and a heart (or the equivalent of these organs) and of course they need to get rid of waste as well, which would require a urinary system.

[Stark]

Even if it was retarded enough to have internal organs (and trust me, it wouldn't surprise me for a second), what genetic information would it have? The skin is grown in vats and just applied to the chassis to get a certain look. Would it even have a complete human DNA thingy? One could argue that to convince animals it'd need a lymph system (or at least sweat), but there isn't much room under the skeleton. It'd be more plausible on Arnie, since he seemed to be significantly wider than the chassis under the skin (particularly his shoulders).

I eagerly await Terminator falling to the level of the AvP movies.

[weemadando]

SHE DOESN'T HAVE THE HARDWARE!

She may have an organic cunt grafted onto her metal chassis to give John something to while away the hours with, but the entire design philosophy of the terminators makes it quite FUCKING CLEAR that they do not have the pointless squishy internal organs. Which are quite, quite necessary to sustain life in the womb.

I'll try and break it down for you. It needs:
Heart and full circulatory connection in order for the fetus to you know, have blood supply.
Lungs and full respiratory tract to supply them in order for the blood to be oxygenated.
Stomach and Intestinal tract to supply other squidgy bits with requisite sustenance.
Liver and Kidneys and Spleen so the blood can kept clean, in working order and filled with all the needed nutrients and goodness.
Any fucking number of glands, nodes and other bits from which hormones, proteins and other secretions are created which are all fucking necessary.

Now. Try fitting all of that in an artificial form into Cameron's svelte little chassis. I'll give you a hint. This is an artificial kidney (dialysis machine).



And that's a small one. For the haemo-dialysis that would be required for pregnancy support you'd need a bigger one. And they use many MANY litres of water, bi-carb and numerous other chemicals in the process. So unless Cameron was going to be chugging chemicals for the duration of the pregnancy and diverting them to the enormous growth on her back that is the dialysis machine, then it's not even going to start to happen.

For all of Skynet's brilliance, billions of years of evolution had allowed us to have some very nice, miniaturised and finely tweaked components that are a fucking bitch to replicate.

[Anguirus]

I actually suspect that all Terminators can eat. In a cut scene (possibly not even filmed) of the original Terminator, Arnold's character ate a candy bar (paper and all). The idea was that he needed to nourish his living tissue.

[weemadando]

I actually suspect that all Terminators can eat. In a cut scene (possibly not even filmed) of the original Terminator, Arnold's character ate a candy bar (paper and all). The idea was that he needed to nourish his living tissue.

HOW? It makes no sense. Did I forget to mention how fucking complex the systems required to make digestion and distribution of these products are?

[Drooling Iguana]

One could argue that to convince animals it'd need a lymph system (or at least sweat),

Terminators don't convince animals.

[18-Till-I-Die]

Well, look, if she isn't "really" eating then where is all that stuff going? I mean she's had at least a few meals since the show began, probably ate at school, and other such instances...it cant all still be in there, rotting away in her empty shell, or else it'd fuck up the works. It'd release chemicals, probably fuck up the artificial skin. She has to have something at least vaguely similar to a digestive tract to eat that way, indeed the artificial skin can both bleed and, according to Kyle Reese, sweat and develop BO so there are some organs or organelles or something under all that crap. The fact that her skeleton is mechanical doesn't mean her muscle and skin tissue isn't, or that something INSIDE of the skeleton isnt.

Simply to have skin, blood, sweat and body oder, let alone to eat, she'd have to have something like a heart (a simple mechanical pump is sufficient) a liver (ditto) and a system of carrying blood and fluids around the body, as well as disposing of waste. I mean really, think about it, these things would be piss poor "infiltrators" if they were so inhuman they never slept, sweat, bled, pissed, shat, ate, drank, smelled like roses and on top of it acted robotically as they do...the latter you can write off, and many a deceased TechCom solider probably did, as shell shock but not the rest. And if that were true, eventually their skin would rot away and they'd either look like robots outright or look like Edgar from MIB and neither is very useful for infiltration. To my mind it was always sort of a given that they had at least some (mechanical analogues to) internal organs and systems. I mean especially since they're outright called "cyborgs" which has a very specific, and rather organic, definition, instead of just androids or robots.

Now, do i think she can have a baby? No of course not. But do i think she probably has more organic parts than we'd care to think. Which, frankly, just makes it all the creepier.

[18-Till-I-Die]

Ghetto edit:

Should read

The fact that her skeleton is mechanical doesn't mean her muscle and skin tissue is, or that something INSIDE of the skeleton is.

[18-Till-I-Die]

Oh yeah and we know one of them lived with a human woman for several years, and had sex with her and ate and drank with her, probably also used the bathroom around her a few times too.

So that right there means that, by all rights, they can at least cum, eat, drink, piss and shit, and pretend to sleep too, or else any reasonably normal human being would suspect them of being at the very least physically ill if not inhuman. Plus i get the impression he was able to show emotion, and Terminators on the whole can, far better than we would expect when they care to, Cameron probably doesnt cause she doesnt want or need to. She's not trying to fool John and Sarah so she has no reason to. When she WAS trying to fool them she was able to act like a perfectly normal, if very taciturn, human and i reckon all Terminators can. Otherwise, again, they'd be all but useless as spies or infiltrators as they could be IDed in an instant.

[brianeyci]

I'm watching The Terminator right now, and suffice it to say Terminators having babies is a... complete violation of what a Terminator is. Even if it happens the problem is easily solved by ignoring Sarah Connor Chronicles as canon.

But let's assume it is possible. Why would Skynet want to do it? Only the most advanced, highly specialized infiltration units would even need this. Units like Cameron, designed for long-term deep cover assignments. But as mentioned already, dogs can root out Terminators. There doesn't seem to be much of a point in deep cover infiltration units in a post-apocalyptic world, and John Connor's military was competent. Meaning they'd have low-tech safeguards like word and password, safeguards used by the real military right now. And if you take Sarah Connor Chronicles as canon, Reese immediately identified Cameron as a Terminator, "metal!"

Most of Skynet's irrational behaviour you can explain (or excuse depending on your mileage) as desire to inflict as much pain and suffering as possible, to make humans fear Skynet. So, human-like Terminators, hugeass robot tanks that look scary, terrorizing human camps with a single Terminator rather than destroying it with a guided munition. But having a baby? Doesn't fit with Skynet's character at all.

Let's face it, Terminators even in Sarah Connor Chronicles don't have the social skills to take advantage of deep cover assignments. Cameron fits in because she stays out of the way in hiding, but if she tried to become student council president or tried to get a boyfriend or even tried to join a school club she'd stick out like a sore fucking thumb. When Cameron was in the principal's office, the way she asked and answered questions was completely off. Unhuman like behaviour would be noticed immediately in Reese's world.

[18-Till-I-Die]

Yeah but then you have the Terminator that had a relationship with that woman. He ate with her, drank wine with her, had sex with her, probably had long discussions with her. And even then Reese said that Terminators can bleed, sweat, smell and one would presume generate other bodily fluids. The fact we have two (three if the afore mentioned deleted scene counts) instances of Terminators eating mean they probably have some kind of digestive system, most likely an artificial one. And just to pass as humans AT ALL they'd have to be able to at least fake sleeping, pissing and shitting or people would get wise.

The way Cameron and other Terminators swing from "toaster with a voice box" to "uncanny valley" probably indicates that they can, in fact, simulate human emotion if need be...shit i mean, Uncle Bob supposedly even was able to suss out what human emotion like fear, pain and sadness actually MEANT and he'd only been around humans, at most, two to three days. A terminator around humans for longer periods of time probably could almsot completely act like a human, if they choose to. Some chose not to once their cover is blown, afterall maintaining the illusion is not important after that.

Then also Reese's brother knew that was a Terminator not because he "identified" her but because he met her in the future, as seen in a later episode, he saw her with other reprogramed Terminators and probably thought she was of that same model. So Reese's reaction proves nothing other than he knew her in the future, or a Terminator that looked like her.

Look i dont think they can have babies either but the fact is they're clearly more organic than people suspect. They'd be COMPLETELY useless if they were as inhuman as some peopel assume, not just useless as "deep cover" agents but useless PERIOD.

[Shroom Man 777]

In the T2 novelization, it explained Uncle Bob's sussing out of the Meaning of Life (42 hurrr!) by calling it Robot Brain Damage.

What model is River, anyway?

[Stark]

Terminators don't convince animals.

Really? I thought the decent ones with the real skin worked sort-of against animals: I haven't seen Terminator in a while, but I thought the 'flashback Terminator' walked past some dogs at the entrance to the base? I doubt it's 'good', but I was under the impression that they had some success at this (although doubtless trained dogs can spot them anyway).

[MKSheppard]

I haven't seen Terminator in a while, but I thought the 'flashback Terminator' walked past some dogs at the entrance to the base? .

The dogs started barkin right away.

[Shroom Man 777]

And then he killed everyone.

[Sarevok]

What model is River, anyway?

F-800 Fangirl.

HOW? It makes no sense. Did I forget to mention how fucking complex the systems required to make digestion and distribution of these products are?

Who says it is digestion ? It could some form of regeration using magic nanite. Like how the cyborg protagonist in Deus Ex can use his nanites to break down certain forms of food and use it to repair damaged systems.

[18-Till-I-Die]

In the T2 novelization, it explained Uncle Bob's sussing out of the Meaning of Life (42 hurrr!) by calling it Robot Brain Damage.

Even if that is the case the capacity must be there anyway, but locked down unless needed. If i get brain damage i dont suddenly jump 400 IQ points...brain damage TAKES AWAY mental capacity, it doesn't add it. What that probably means, realistically, is that a Terminator can and sometimes will utilize emotions but generally turns them "off", like a sociopath switch. This is a very useful trait for an assassin of any type, to be honest. But Uncle Bob lost the capacity to turn his off after a while so he became used to them.

What model is River, anyway?

I believe...that she said she was a "Triple-Eight" or mentioned it once; considering it's dangerously close to saying "Triple H" i found that rather humorous in retrospect.

[Stark]

The dogs started barkin right away.

Oh. How'd he get in then? I remember a shot of the dogs, and he just kept going in. Was there too many people coming in and out to detain him or something?

[18-Till-I-Die]

The dogs started barkin right away.

Oh. How'd he get in then? I remember a shot of the dogs, and he just kept going in. Was there too many people coming in and out to detain him or something?

Well, he cam in starppin' a huge fucking gun that looked about the size of one of those autocannons on a Bradley so i'd assume he shot his way in.