Health Care Financial Issues

[Flameblade]

First off, I'm not certain if this should go in SLAM or N&P, since it does involve a hot-button issue in the US, right now.

I've been debating a family member on the relative merits of state provided health care versus private insurance. One of the issues that has come up repeatedly is whether the medical bills are something that you would need to ever file bankruptcy or lose your house from. I've heard quite often that this is the case. Said family member is arguing that your wages can't be garnished from medical bills and that the worst that will happen to you is you would receive call from a collections agency. Suffice to say I find it hard to believe that so many people would lose their houses if they could just ignore these debts like they ignore their credit cards.

Aside from not having the first clue about where to find reliable information on this, I'm also wondering whether, if it is the case that these medical bills aren't really enforceable, whether it would be ethical or moral to try to tell as many people as possible. My inclination is toward yes, because people might refuse to get necessary care because of their fear of financial hardship, while the damage would be the loss of corporate profits.

Whether or not it turns out to be true, I wonder if such a stance actually is moral or ethical.

[Broomstick]

Where the hell did he get the notion your wages can't be garnished to pay health care induced debt? They can. It is also possible for the holder of your debt (any debt) to have a lien put against your assets, such as your house (if you own one).

The worst that can happen isn't that, though - it is at least theoretically possible to have your debt-ridden ass hauled into court and convicted of fraud via the mechanism of running up bills you had no intention of paying, hiding assets, or simply ignoring the requirement to pay your debts, and you wind up doing jail time.

[Flameblade]

Is that the sort of thing that varies from state to state? Heck would you happen to know where one could find that sort of thing in the legal code? Because I'd basically said the same thing and told to prove it. I've looked about but can't find anything one way or another. I mean, hell, is this something that can vary by whether or not you're on Medicare? I've heard anecdotes on either side of this, both online and off, and I happen to agree with my signature here.

Is this something where a trained monkey should be able to find the hard proof or should I poke at a lawyer about this, get their thoughts?

EDIT: Is there a difference here between things like going to the emergency room for a life saving procedure and going in to a GP for a check-up and the like?

[Rye]

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/health ... bills.html

Sixty-two percent of all bankruptcies filed in 2007 were linked to medical expenses, according to a nationwide study released today by the American Journal of Medicine. That's nearly 20 percentage points higher than that pool of respondents reported were connected to medical costs in 2001.

Of those who filed for bankruptcy in 2007, nearly 80 percent had health insurance. Respondents who reported having insurance indicated average expenses of just under $18,000. Respondents who filed and lacked insurance had average medical bills of nearly $27,000.

Since 2007, the number of Americans without insurance has increased and filing for bankruptcy has become more difficult due to more stringent laws, according to the report.

The authors of the study, David Himmelstein, Deborah Thorne, Elizabeth Warren and Steffie Woolhandler, say their findings "reflect the U.S. health care financing system is broken." Middle class families, they conclude, "frequently collapse under the strain of the health care system that treats physical wounds, but inflicts fiscal ones."

[Broomstick]

Is that the sort of thing that varies from state to state?

I'd say yes, just because so many things do vary from state to state, except that it's pretty universal you can't just go "neener neener I'm not paying!"

I mean, hell, is this something that can vary by whether or not you're on Medicare?

Not really - if you're destitute someone you owe money to might not wish to pursue a claim just because there's nothing there to gain, but being on Medicare is not a "get out of debt free" card.

Is this something where a trained monkey should be able to find the hard proof or should I poke at a lawyer about this, get their thoughts?

Yes, and if you want to you can ask a lawyer.

EDIT: Is there a difference here between things like going to the emergency room for a life saving procedure and going in to a GP for a check-up and the like?

No, in both cases the people you owe money to will attempt to collect the debt. In fact, if a medical provider wishes to maintain eligibility for either Medicaid or Medicare they MUST make a good faith effort to collect on any money owed.

[ArmorPierce]

Where the hell did he get the notion your wages can't be garnished to pay health care induced debt? They can. It is also possible for the holder of your debt (any debt) to have a lien put against your assets, such as your house (if you own one).

The worst that can happen isn't that, though - it is at least theoretically possible to have your debt-ridden ass hauled into court and convicted of fraud via the mechanism of running up bills you had no intention of paying, hiding assets, or simply ignoring the requirement to pay your debts, and you wind up doing jail time.

Most judges I don't think (from what I heard, could be wrong) will not grant a lien against your house since it is reasoned that you need a place to live unless it is believed that you are actually able to pay the bill and just not doing so. Fraud is a problem and can get you thrown in jail.

[Broomstick]

Most judges I don't think (from what I heard, could be wrong) will not grant a lien against your house since it is reasoned that you need a place to live unless it is believed that you are actually able to pay the bill and just not doing so.

You don't have to live in a house, you can rent an apartment. A judge might choose to take pity on someone but they don't have to.