Armada 2526: Total War series meets 4X space empire building

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Vyraeth
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Armada 2526: Total War series meets 4X space empire building

Post by Vyraeth »

I searched the board for any threads on this game, and I didn't see any, but there's a new 4X turn-based empire building game near release that I think has potential. It's being developed by the lead designer for Medieval 2: Total War, and so the game looks similar to Total War in the sense that strategic moves are turn-based and focus on a central galaxy map, and battles are resolved with a real time combat engine. The game, as indicated in the thread title is called Armada 2526.
Wargamer: Armada 2526 Write up wrote:Matrix Games (http://www.matrixgames.com) and Ntronium Games (http://www.ntronium.com) have announced that they have reached a publishing agreement for Armada 2526, a space-based blend of turn-based strategy and intense real time space battles. The founder and director of Ntronium Games, R.T. Smith, has been creating strategy games for more than 20 years, including the original 4x space classic Armada 2525. Most recently he was the project director and lead designer for Medieval 2: Total War, having earlier served as designer and programmer on the previous Total War games.

David Heath, Director of Operations at Matrix Games, said “We’re thrilled to be working with a developer and designer who has been the creative direction behind hits like Rome: Total War and Medieval 2: Total War. We’re confident that the critical acclaim his work in the Total War series has enjoyed will translate well into outer space with Armada 2526!”

Armada 2526 continues the great tradition of space opera games. Players guide their race from its first interstellar journeys until it becomes a mighty galactic empire. Along the way, they'll explore the galaxy, conduct research, diplomacy and trade, found new colonies, maneuver mighty star fleets, and fight epic battles. Although the game is complex, and the possible strategies endless, powerful help and advisor features help you get up to speed quickly. Unlike many games in this genre, Armada 2526 boasts a streamlined play system, providing games that can be finished in a reasonable time, and emphasizes battle and strategy over economic micro-management.

Some major features include:

* Turn-Based Strategy Map - The strategy map shows the portion of the galaxy where the game takes place. Here you'll maneuver your fleets, manage your colonies, and grow your empire. The emphasis in this part of the game is thinking and planning, so you can spend as much time as you want planning your strategies, and issuing orders. When you're done, hit the "end turn" button, and your orders will be carried out simultaneously with those of other players.

* Epic Space Battles - Battles can be epic affairs with more than a hundred ships on each side. They are presented to the player in their full majesty via real-time 3D rendering with glowing energy beams, shimmering shields, and spectacular explosions. The action is real-time, both to enhance the visual spectacle, and to introduce elements of tension and pressure; however, the emphasis is firmly on tactics and maneuvering formations, rather than frantic clicking on individual ships, and you always have the option of pausing the battle to issue orders. Planetary assaults are especially intense with ship to ships battles, ground battles and ground to air battles all taking place simultaneously. If the attacker doesn't complete the conquest quickly enough, the battle will continue into the next turn, giving each side the chance to throw in reinforcements.

* Diplomacy - With so many players, you need a full featured diplomatic system. In Armada 2526 you can negotiate offensive and defensive alliance, non aggression pacts and trade agreements. Trade money, technology, colonies, ships and information. You can issue threats and ultimatums, or ask for favors. Friendships can be made and trust earned, or your reputation can be ruined by bullying and not honoring agreements. Negotiations proceed by a series of offers and counter offers. Hard bargaining can drive the price down, but being generous builds friendships. During negotiations, you see an animated view of your counterpart, so you know who you are dealing with, and how they feel.

* Technology - There are many different technology items to research. The game system encourages you to specialize in particular areas of tech, so as you expand and meet new players, you will find that they have radically different capabilities. Many of the technologies are disruptive, and force you to radically alter your strategy and tactics to utilize them, or to cope with the lack of. You may for instance concentrate on building the biggest and best navy in the galaxy, and then watch in dismay as your ships flee from and opponent who has mastered the psychic arts, or are outmaneuvered by an adversary who has specialized in stealth or hyper space technology. You may have turned your planets into fortresses, but this won't help if they are infected by nanobots that eat defenses from the inside out, or if your opponent is impolite enough to drop an asteroid on your favorite colony.

* Powerful AI - The artificial intelligence routines have been created by an expert in the field, to provide AI players that are both worthy adversaries, and opponents that are fun to play against. The A.I. has been built into the game from the beginning of development and updated to take advantage of new game features as they are added, giving the developers the maximum time to polish its behavior. This is in contrast to many games, where the AI is tacked on at the end of development. Of course the same powerful routines developed for the opponents, are also available to assist the player in managing their empire, and to offer game play advice.

Armada 2526 will be available in time for the holiday season. Get more information from its official product page.
http://wargamer.com/article/2790/matrix ... rmada-2526 (quoted article, also has screenshots)

http://www.ntronium.com/Armada2526%20Home.html (official game website)

Although I'm optimistic, I'm concerned that the diplomacy and AI models in the game are simply being hyped up and won't play out as well as they sound now. I know that in generally every strategy title I've played, even the Total War games (except Empire and the expansions for all the games, which I haven't played), diplomacy is hit or miss, and the behavior of the factions involved tends to become erratic. If they do succeed in developing a successful AI and diplomacy system, though, I think that'll make the game all the more impressive.

The only other downside is that multiplayer seems limited to real time battles only, and won't incorporate the turn based campaign (which is similar to how Total War games work, save for Empire: Total War which is supposed to have a two player campaign). But if the single player AI is developed enough, this will still make for an enjoyable play, and one of the better offerings for this genre in years.
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Transbot9
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Re: Armada 2526: Total War series meets 4X space empire building

Post by Transbot9 »

I'd be willing to at least look at it. I just hope the diplomacy isn't as simplistic as GalCiv 2's. The other problem with 4x space games I've played is that often times it comes down to 1. out-research your opponent & 2. slap as many guns on the largest hull you have
There are only two ways the Federation defeats the empire: Either some hot shot idiot of a captain uses the cosmic undo button known time travel (in a poorly written 2-hour special) to undo however the Empire ended up in the Milky Way, or the leftovers join the rebellion after being horribly crushed to provide them with cannon fodder. The OT plays out like normal with any "federation" support being not even notable enough to get a foot-note in the history books.
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Stark
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Re: Armada 2526: Total War series meets 4X space empire building

Post by Stark »

Harshing on GalCiv2's diplomacy really highlights how terrible the entire genre is. If they have both a complex dip system and an AI that can use it, I'll be impressed.

The article is nearly useless though, just being a bunch of buzzwords. Every indy/low-rent game claims to have 'awesome AI' or 'excellent graphics' or whatever.

Then again, Vyraeth just said 'even the Total War games' when talking about AI, so I guess he's easy to impress. :) The screenshots show the interface that suggests it's a far more complex and fiddly game than they suggest (their 'easy econ management' window for instance) and the combat graphics are terrible. I think this will be more SE5 than GalCiv2. Hopefully it'll at least be playable.
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Re: Armada 2526: Total War series meets 4X space empire building

Post by Vendetta »

Stark wrote:Harshing on GalCiv2's diplomacy really highlights how terrible the entire genre is. If they have both a complex dip system and an AI that can use it, I'll be impressed.
Has there ever been a 4x game where the AI is capable of diplomacy other than "make unreasonable demands of player every four turns, despite player's enormous industrial and technological advantage"?

I've lost count of the number of games where I've had to tell the AI to fuck off repeatedly and that they are not getting whatever inane tribute or tech they are currently demanding, eventually leading me to have to pacify them forcibly until they learn.
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Re: Armada 2526: Total War series meets 4X space empire building

Post by Grif »

or if your opponent is impolite enough to drop an asteroid on your favorite colony.
Now, this, I look forward to. :P


I thought Civ4 diplomacy and AI are pretty realistic, since I rarely had AI demanding tribute or such if they did not overpower my army by a significant margin. Sometimes they even proposed tech swaps that made sense. It's been awhile since I played, so I could be mistaken.
Vyraeth
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Re: Armada 2526: Total War series meets 4X space empire building

Post by Vyraeth »

Stark wrote:Harshing on GalCiv2's diplomacy really highlights how terrible the entire genre is. If they have both a complex dip system and an AI that can use it, I'll be impressed.
Agreed.
Stark wrote:Then again, Vyraeth just said 'even the Total War games' when talking about AI, so I guess he's easy to impress. :)
Perhaps, I wasn't clear, but when writing that, I was referring to how dodgy the Total Wars series diplomacy systems tend to be. For instance in Medieval 2: Total War, I've found the factions I've played against to be quite erratic in their actions. Breaking peace agreements suddenly to declare war (with no provoking cause), etc.

If this game actually has diplomacy that's sensible, it'll be impressive.
Stark wrote:The article is nearly useless though, just being a bunch of buzzwords. Every indy/low-rent game claims to have 'awesome AI' or 'excellent graphics' or whatever.
Yeah, the article is obviously a bunch of hype, but it does give some perspective as to what this game offers, and the website gives an even better picture. There's actually a discussion about the designer on his principle for AI, but many games for years have promised good AI, so rather this one delivers or not we'll see. I certainly hope it does, though.

Regardless, I find their cheesy promo video hilarious. Even if it does possess certain cool things, like hurling an asteroid at a planet. I just hope that these special attacks, the nanobots, and asteroid throwing don't devolve into lame gimmicks.

The best test of course, will be the play through.
Stark wrote:The screenshots show the interface that suggests it's a far more complex and fiddly game than they suggest (their 'easy econ management' window for instance) and the combat graphics are terrible.
I thought the graphics were pretty decent, especially for an independent game in this genre, but maybe if I played more newer titles, I'd think less of them.

The only thing that looks awkward to me, visually, is the way they handle ground combat. The ships and scaling of the soldiers are really off, but I guess they didn't want to spend time programming a decent ground combat engine.
Stark wrote:I think this will be more SE5 than GalCiv2. Hopefully it'll at least be playable.
I haven't actually played SE5, but I did play SEIV and enjoyed it. But after playing GalCiv 2, I'd definitely prefer a 4X game more in the Space Empires vein. And yeah, I hope the game is playable as well. The website is tacky, but I have confidence in the developer and what's been created so far.
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Re: Armada 2526: Total War series meets 4X space empire building

Post by Stark »

Vendetta wrote:Has there ever been a 4x game where the AI is capable of diplomacy other than "make unreasonable demands of player every four turns, despite player's enormous industrial and technological advantage"?

I've lost count of the number of games where I've had to tell the AI to fuck off repeatedly and that they are not getting whatever inane tribute or tech they are currently demanding, eventually leading me to have to pacify them forcibly until they learn.
It's the terrible combination (generally) of extremely limited dip options and totally retarded diplomatic AI. GalCiv2's biggest problem was the lack of options (especially options the AI had and the player didn't), whereas SE5 has piles but little real ability to judge 'good' and 'bad' deals (or to know when to shut the fuck up). I mean, SE5 also didn't work, but hey. I'm not confident these guys will manage SE5-type complexity with GalCiv2-type coherency and transparency, regardless of how many times they say 'EXPERT IN THE FIELD'.
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montypython
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Re: Armada 2526: Total War series meets 4X space empire building

Post by montypython »

Played Armada 2525 back in the day, was pretty decent and had some clever ideas too, this does look promising. At the very least it finally does the 3d ground and space combat bit that too many other games just gloss over, so hope it turns out well.
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