thrawn + clones

Enforcer Talen · Post by **Enforcer Talen** » 2002-08-19 05:46am

makes you wonder why he didn't clone himself - 30 or 40 clones, each on their own star destroyer, could have carved out some huge chunks of the new republic.

Raxmei · Post by **Raxmei** » 2002-08-19 05:49am

Thrawn did clone himself.

Enforcer Talen · Post by **Enforcer Talen** » 2002-08-19 05:52am

and set it ten yrs later (I skimmed that book, so plz summarize)

why not use 30 or 40 during his first war, before he got knifed?

Post by **Mr Bean** » 2002-08-19 07:32am

Becuase thats 30-40 hims running around he probably looked within himself saw what made him him relised oh wait any clones of me will try and over-throw me, best not do it, but I'd be glad to have me ready to go after I'm dead

Ehh say ten years

And so it was done

consequences · Post by **consequences** » 2002-08-19 10:51am

10 years seems like an unnecessarily long time, Just keep a dedicated Holocomm receiver linked to the clone unit, set to only detect a specific innocuous message that you have sent out every couple of days, when you stop sending the messaage, probably because you are dead, the waarm-up procedure starts.

Stravo · Post by **Stravo** » 2002-08-19 11:07am

Because cloning great villains SUCKS as a storyline and tells me one thing....I am UNORIGINAL, I could never hope to write as good a character as Thrawn so instead I will clone him and make all the sacrfices and adventures everyone had to go through to kill the original mean nothing.

Unfortunately, this statement seems to describe a majority of the EU writers.

Post by **Mr Bean** » 2002-08-19 11:51am

Not nessary Stravo, What if the Clone is nothing like the Orgional? What if the Clone is Nuts? What if its a SUPER CLONE!

If you clone great villians you can still make them intresting if you twist them

to a certian point of view

Stravo · Post by **Stravo** » 2002-08-19 12:21pm

Mr Bean wrote:Not nessary Stravo, What if the Clone is nothing like the Orgional? What if the Clone is Nuts? What if its a SUPER CLONE!

If you clone great villians you can still make them intresting if you twist them

to a certian point of view

I get what you're saying Mr. Beam but I am EXTREMELY wary of these potential storylines becuase there are so many ways that they can go wrong.

Post by **Mr Bean** » 2002-08-19 12:28pm

To quote an old line

*What can change the nature of a man?

Yes they can go wrong... but if you can pull them off sometimes they are the best of all storys

Darth Yoshi · Post by **Darth Yoshi** » 2002-08-19 04:40pm

consequences wrote:10 years seems like an unnecessarily long time, Just keep a dedicated Holocomm receiver linked to the clone unit, set to only detect a specific innocuous message that you have sent out every couple of days, when you stop sending the messaage, probably because you are dead, the waarm-up procedure starts.

Remember that Thrawn is a genius. As such, cloning him is a delicate process. Any mistakes, and you might get someone with Greedo level intelligence, or worse, a madman with Thrawn's genius. In TLC, Thrawn suggested cloning C'baoth to childhood, then allowing him to grow normally for ten or fifteen years. Since the Thrawn clone was a secret project that no one knew about, he can't clone himself to childhood and let the clone mature normally. So, he has to clone himself to adulthood. He can't do it in less than a year, either, otherwise his clone will suffer from clone madness. In TLC, he wouldn't risk cloning C'baoth in that short a time frame, even with the ysalamiri blockng off the Force. So he wouldn't risk his clone like that, either. Ten years probably seemed reasonable for his clone to mature into adulthood without risk of madness.

Enforcer Talen · Post by **Enforcer Talen** » 2002-08-20 03:53am

Mr Bean wrote:Becuase thats 30-40 hims running around he probably looked within himself saw what made him him relised oh wait any clones of me will try and over-throw me, best not do it, but I'd be glad to have me ready to go after I'm dead

Ehh say ten years

And so it was done

course, that assumes thrawn would overthrow himself instead of working for the empire's expansion. . .depends on how loyal he was to the empire concept as opposed to personal power.

Enforcer Talen · Post by **Enforcer Talen** » 2002-08-20 03:55am

Darth Yoshi wrote:
consequences wrote:10 years seems like an unnecessarily long time, Just keep a dedicated Holocomm receiver linked to the clone unit, set to only detect a specific innocuous message that you have sent out every couple of days, when you stop sending the messaage, probably because you are dead, the waarm-up procedure starts.
Remember that Thrawn is a genius. As such, cloning him is a delicate process. Any mistakes, and you might get someone with Greedo level intelligence, or worse, a madman with Thrawn's genius. In TLC, Thrawn suggested cloning C'baoth to childhood, then allowing him to grow normally for ten or fifteen years. Since the Thrawn clone was a secret project that no one knew about, he can't clone himself to childhood and let the clone mature normally. So, he has to clone himself to adulthood. He can't do it in less than a year, either, otherwise his clone will suffer from clone madness. In TLC, he wouldn't risk cloning C'baoth in that short a time frame, even with the ysalamiri blockng off the Force. So he wouldn't risk his clone like that, either. Ten years probably seemed reasonable for his clone to mature into adulthood without risk of madness.

I thought he couldn't use ysalarmi on c'boath cuz he was a jedi master? it's been a while since I read the thrawn trilogy, so feel free to correct me. but I remember him cloning hundreds or thousands of elite tie pilots in weeks- couldn't he do similar with top commanders such as himself, even if it took two or three times as long?

Darth Yoshi · Post by **Darth Yoshi** » 2002-08-20 03:12pm

Here's the quote. Pg. 316, Hardcover:

"Why not?" Thrawn asked. "Not at Mount tantiss itself, certainly, given the conditions there. Most likely not at that speed, either --- that's all well and good for techs and TIE fighter pilots, but not a project of this delicacy. No, I envision brining such a clone to childnood and then allowing to grow to maturity at a normal pace for its last ten or fifteen years. Under suitable upbringing conditions, of course."

He doesn't mention the fact that C'baoth is a Jedi Master. And the sentence "Most likely not at that speed, either" implies that C'baoth can be cloned successfully under the handicap of ysalamiri. And IIRC, in VOTF, the Thrawn clone was inside an ysalamiri field.

Grand Admiral Thrawn · Post by **Grand Admiral Thrawn** » 2002-08-20 04:06pm

*cough* Zahn wrote about the Thrawn clone...

Lord Poe · Post by **Lord Poe** » 2002-08-21 09:41pm

Actually, I believe the Thrawn killed on the Chimaera was a clone.

Note in HttE, someone shoots a crossbow bolt at him, but it bounces off his uniform due to the armor he has underneath.

In TLC, no armor? Why?

Also, many have written about the similarities between Thrawn/Pellaeon and Sherlock/Watson. The clues are, Sherlock Holmes, in "The Final Problem", goes over Reichenbach Falls with Moriarty, but in the next story, we find that Holmes didn't actually fall in, and returns.

The other clue is the full name of Thrawn's bodyguard; "Rukh clan Baik'var" which resembles the name of the waterfall in Switzerland Holmes went over. Next clue, the last we see of Thrawn's clone is it washing away on a tide of water. Never a definite statement on whether the clone died or not.

Master of Ossus · Post by **Master of Ossus** » 2002-08-21 09:45pm

Lord Poe wrote:Actually, I believe the Thrawn killed on the Chimaera was a clone.

Note in HttE, someone shoots a crossbow bolt at him, but it bounces off his uniform due to the armor he has underneath.

In TLC, no armor? Why?

Also, many have written about the similarities between Thrawn/Pellaeon and Sherlock/Watson. The clues are, Sherlock Holmes, in "The Final Problem", goes over Reichenbach Falls with Moriarty, but in the next story, we find that Holmes didn't actually fall in, and returns.

The other clue is the full name of Thrawn's bodyguard; "Rukh clan Baik'var" which resembles the name of the waterfall in Switzerland Holmes went over. Next clue, the last we see of Thrawn's clone is it washing away on a tide of water. Never a definite statement on whether the clone died or not.

I've always wondered about that. Incidentally, I used to live near a town called Meiringen, which is the closest town to those falls. No one could have survived the drop.

We must remember, though, that Holmes' "ressurection" was ridiculously weak. It was caused by riots in London in response to Holmes' death. By that time in the series, Holmes had trained Watson enough that Watson should have been able to see signs of Holmes' escape from the falls.

Darth Yoshi · Post by **Darth Yoshi** » 2002-08-21 10:31pm

Lord Poe wrote:Actually, I believe the Thrawn killed on the Chimaera was a clone.

Note in HttE, someone shoots a crossbow bolt at him, but it bounces off his uniform due to the armor he has underneath.

In TLC, no armor? Why?

Also, many have written about the similarities between Thrawn/Pellaeon and Sherlock/Watson. The clues are, Sherlock Holmes, in "The Final Problem", goes over Reichenbach Falls with Moriarty, but in the next story, we find that Holmes didn't actually fall in, and returns.

The other clue is the full name of Thrawn's bodyguard; "Rukh clan Baik'var" which resembles the name of the waterfall in Switzerland Holmes went over. Next clue, the last we see of Thrawn's clone is it washing away on a tide of water. Never a definite statement on whether the clone died or not.

If that was a clone, then where did Thrawn hide for ten years, and why did he let Daala have control? In fact, Talon Karrde expressed puzzlement about the fact that Thrawn let the Empire go to waste, when he coud have salvaged the situation.