Failings of the Federation

Typhonis 1 · Post by **Typhonis 1** » 2003-04-05 08:23pm

OK people in your opinion what are the biggest failinf of the Federation as of Star Trek Nemesis?

Marc Xavier · Post by **Marc Xavier** » 2003-04-05 08:36pm

Letting the Romulan Empire sit qietly along their border for 80+ years while gathering next to no intelligence about them.

Taking this long to convince Riker to get his own stupid ship.

Promoting Janeway to an ADMIRAL (someone shoot me please).

Not getting better non-diegetic music / a better a national anthem

*listening to the Rebel Alliance Theme*

The music in that movie could have been soo much better...

aerius · Post by **aerius** » 2003-04-05 08:53pm

Being a bunch of pacifists and hoping that by being non-threatening it will solve all problems. They have the best R&D and likely the largest industrial base in the alpha quadrant they don't use it to improve their military. They have captured cloaking technology, which they didn't develop, phase cloak, which they didn't continue research on, the deflector dish beam they used on the borg wasn't made into a viable weapon, and the list is almost endless.

Put some R&D into these technologies, mass pruduce ships made for war and train the crews properly and with help from intelligence and Section 31 they could take over the entire alpha quadrant. Section 31 made a bug that could wipe out the founders, they should be able to make bugs that can wipe out any race. Start a war of conquest and if anyone wants to argue threaten to let the bug loose on them, one by one the races will fall under the boot of the mighty Federation.

I can dream can't I?

Marc Xavier · Post by **Marc Xavier** » 2003-04-05 08:54pm

Mirror, mirror, I should say.

Uraniun235 · Post by **Uraniun235** » 2003-04-06 12:24am

Letting Riker achieve command rank, let alone letting him command a ship.

Marc Xavier wrote:The music in that movie could have been soo much better...

I blame Berman for that. He seems to hate music in general.

Typhonis 1 · Post by **Typhonis 1** » 2003-04-06 12:40am

note this is about all of the Federations failings in TNG DS9 and VOY

Marc Xavier · Post by **Marc Xavier** » 2003-04-06 01:18am

Putting Janeway on a starship in the first place.

Darth Fanboy · Post by **Darth Fanboy** » 2003-04-06 04:06am

I think the instability of their warp cores sux most.

Marc Xavier · Post by **Marc Xavier** » 2003-04-06 04:11am

How about the fact that the ejection systems hardly ever work when they're supposed to (when there's an emergency and the core needs to be ejected?)

Stormbringer · Post by **Stormbringer** » 2003-04-06 12:42pm

Typhonis 1 wrote:OK people in your opinion what are the biggest failinf of the Federation as of Star Trek Nemesis?

Limp wristed policies. They have no army or marines worth the name and their ships are a spacegoing monument to "the jack of all trades, master of none" motto. The UFP left determined enemies alone until they were at their throats and then fought back. They shafted their own citizens to avoid fighting a war they could have won easily enough.

And then of course there is there absolutely piss poor saftey standards. I mean how many times can the transporters/holodeck/warp core/ship's computer try to kill you before you think of replacing it?

HappyTarget · Post by **HappyTarget** » 2003-04-06 05:21pm

Start a war of conquest and if anyone wants to argue threaten to let the bug loose on them, one by one the races will fall under the boot of the mighty Federation.

I can dream can't I?

Terran Empire Forever!

Marc Xavier · Post by **Marc Xavier** » 2003-04-06 05:24pm

Until they got their butts kicked by the Klingons and Cardassians and turned into lowly slaves.

Stupid Spock ..... oh, wait..

consequences · Post by **consequences** » 2003-04-06 05:46pm

Screw the canon Mirror Universe, go with the one from "Dark Mirror".

Tsyroc · Post by **Tsyroc** » 2003-04-06 06:42pm

consequences wrote:Screw the canon Mirror Universe, go with the one from "Dark Mirror".

The Mirror version of the Enterprise-D was cool (lots more weapons) but that book had a lot of TNG style treknobable in it.

consequences · Post by **consequences** » 2003-04-06 06:50pm

which means it was true to style, AND a better story.

kmart · Post by **kmart** » 2003-04-09 03:20pm

I think the way they dealt with the maquis was indicative of most that is wrong with 24th century Federation.

They watch some really fine Starfleet folk defect, people who have dedicated their lives to the UFP now throwing their careers away because of the ethical obligation to support a legitimate officially unsupported cause, and still the Feds and SF command DON'T GET IT. They're not on the side they're supposed to be on (i.e. good guys), they're making things worse by sticking with their treaties.

I'd have been happier with them doing an INSURRECTION style NextGen feature film years earlier, but instead of doing the Blonde Peole in the briar patch, involving the regulars in conflict with one another, with some helping the maquis instead of the way the maquis were just disposed of on DS9.

I really like a lot of DS9 (the non Ferengi stuff and the non-Dax stuff, that is), but the way the whole maquis issue just went away really bothered me. (Eddington is probably my favorite 24th century human.)

I just reread what I wrote above about SFC not realizing they are in the wrong and it reminded me of Melinda Snodgrass' unproduced version of NextGen's HIGH GROUND. According to interviews, she wanted to make it so the Enterprise doesn't realize that the rebellion is legitimate, and they only catch on that they are oppressing the wrong people late in the show. It wasn't this Ireland type story at all, but more like the US throwing off the British in 1776. Could have been pretty potent, but that was when Snodgrass was, in her words, "having my hands tied behind my back and told to write." Too bad, since if she'd stayed and been able to really go to work w/o interference from Berman and I guess Pillar, we might have gotten some more real gems out of her like MEASURE OF A MAN.

Ted C · Post by **Ted C** » 2003-04-09 04:02pm

The UFP is just mind-numbingly complacent. That may seem like a strange observation, but look at typical events...

They routinely place starships or even whole colonies at risk with experimental technology ("New Ground" and "Remember Me"), but no one gets punished for their recklessness.

Their safety systems frequently fail (the infamous problems with the warp core and holodecks), and there's no sign of any effort to fix them.

Their security is incredibly porous (an outsider like Roga Danar can easily maneuver around the ship and sabotage it in "The Hunted", and an unauthorized kid can launch a shuttle in "Coming of Age").

They know the Romulans are hostile, but their only action is to put up a "fence" of sorts on the border and ignore them.

When you put the history of the Federation, as we know it, into perspective, you realize that these people are clueless. As Mike observed after seeing "I, Borg", they deserve to be conquered.

HappyTarget · Post by **HappyTarget** » 2003-04-09 04:59pm

Until they got their butts kicked by the Klingons and Cardassians and turned into lowly slaves.

Stupid Spock ..... oh, wait..

Bah, canon... who needs it! Just go to my fan fic here[/shameless plug]

The UFP is just mind-numbingly complacent. That may seem like a strange observation, but look at typical events...
(snip)
When you put the history of the Federation, as we know it, into perspective, you realize that these people are clueless. As Mike observed after seeing "I, Borg", they deserve to be conquered.

Unfortunately, your observations are all to true. GRRR stupid writers...

Admiral Johnason · Post by **Admiral Johnason** » 2003-04-09 09:30pm

The whole Prime Directive and the fact that they are mostly tree-hugging hippies.

Andrew Joshua Talon · Post by **Andrew Joshua Talon** » 2003-04-10 10:05am

Yes yes, and I suppose you'd all rather live in an oppressive, totalitarian, quasi-theocratic dictatorship (coughtheEmpirecough).

Okay, yes: The Federation could do things a whole lot better, in many ways. And so can the Romulans, Klingons, New Republic, and ESPECIALLY the Empire. But look: The price of being a free society is that you have to live up to your morals to outsiders, otherwise what does it matter to go into space?

The Federation's getting over it's pacifist mentality slowly: They actually built some ships that can kick ass if in under the right captain (of which there are slowly but surely going to be more) like the Akira and the Sovereign. Can you blame them for trying to give people the benefit of the doubt? They have hope for peace: And yes, this may lead to them looking like fools, but they've managed to hold themselves together for over two hundred years without becoming a dictatorship. They've got faults all civilizations have to overcome.

So hold your tongue, baka, and try to find something rational to complain about.

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2003-04-10 10:09am

Andrew Joshua Talon wrote:(coughtheEmpirecough).So hold your tongue, baka, and try to find something rational to complain about.

Fuck off and die, troll. If you can't see the multiple things wrong with
the federation, then you're too stupid to live, fucknut

Micheal Ryans, Beta pilot · Post by **Micheal Ryans, Beta pilot** » 2003-04-11 02:04pm

Frankly, I'd prefer the Empire to the Federation, if only because I'd know there is a competent militry force keeping tabs on things like rebellions and invasions.

The biggest mistake the Feddies made was designing the flying deathtrap, also known as a GCS, although that isn't the only one.

It'd take hours to list all of them.

Smiling Bandit · Post by **Smiling Bandit** » 2003-04-11 05:17pm

Fuck off and die, troll. If you can't see the multiple things wrong with the federation, then you're too stupid to live, fucknut

This was NOT called for. Can it.

And both of you stay away from VERSUS threads here!

Now the federation's biggets problem is that they out enormous power into an incompetant military-controlled bureaucracy. Unlike Japan before WWII, they are super-pacifistic, to the point of ignoring obvious threats. They also seem to lack any sort of bureaucratic responsibility, and the QA department stinks.

Lord Pounder · Post by **Lord Pounder** » 2003-04-11 06:05pm

The Federations failings?

1) Technology that always fucks up in a life threatening way. How many times do you need a car to crash into a wall before you work out the engines fucked?

2) Leaders with no balls. How many times have we seen the feddies walk into trouble yet back off and back off when deal with cultures who will walk all over ya if you give them a chance

3) Diplomats that suck. How many war, skirmishes have been caused by shitty 1st contact procedures. Every time the Feddies find a race they start a war i.e. the Romulans, The Klingons, The Ferengi, the Cardies, need i go on?

4) Scientists being given top ships. Janeways failing is that she is a scientist 1st and foremost and Ships commander second. Time and time again we see Star Ship Captains walking into hazardous situations all in the name of exploration. For the love of fuck just put out a warning beakon and fly arround the black hole/nebula/whatever.

5) Shitty Security Officer Training. 1,000's of dead red/yellow shirts speak for themselves.

6) Civilians in battle. How many timed do we see the Enterprise D walking into battle with the saucer section still loaded. I was recently watching the early TNG episodes. If they load the civies onto the saucer they eliminate a potential disaster AND increase the Enterprises fighting ability.

I can go on but i'm tired.

Grand Admiral Thrawn · Post by **Grand Admiral Thrawn** » 2003-04-11 09:17pm

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StarDestroyer.Net BBS

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