Warnings ignored, says retired Marine

[BoredShirtless]

Warnings ignored, says retired Marine
By Rick Rogers
UNION-TRIBUNE STAFF WRITER
April 16, 2004

Retired Marine Gen. Anthony Zinni wondered aloud yesterday how Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld could be caught off guard by the chaos in Iraq that has killed nearly 100 Americans in recent weeks and led to his announcement that 20,000 U.S. troops would be staying there instead of returning home as planned.

"I'm surprised that he is surprised because there was a lot of us who were telling him that it was going to be thus," said Zinni, a Marine for 39 years and the former commander of the U.S. Central Command. "Anyone could know the problems they were going to see. How could they not?"

At a Pentagon news briefing yesterday, Rumsfeld said he could not have estimated how many troops would be killed in the past week.

Zinni made his comments during an interview with The San Diego Union-Tribune before giving a speech last night at the University of San Diego's Joan B. Kroc Institute for Peace & Justice as part of its distinguished lecturer series.

For years Zinni said he cautioned U.S. officials that an Iraq without Saddam Hussein would likely be more dangerous to U.S. interests than one with him because of the ethnic and religious clashes that would be unleashed.

"I think that some heads should roll over Iraq," Zinni said. "I think the president got some bad advice."

Known as the "Warrior Diplomat," Zinni is not a peace activist by nature or training, having led troops in Vietnam, commanded rescue operations in Somalia and directed strikes against Iraq and al Qaeda.

He once commanded the 1st Marine Expeditionary Force at Camp Pendleton.

Out of uniform, Zinni was a troubleshooter for the U.S. government in Africa, Asia and Europe and served as special envoy to the Middle East under the Bush administration for a time before his reservations over the Iraq war and its aftermath caused him to resign and oppose it.

Not even Zinni's resumé could shield him from the accusations that followed.

"I've been called a traitor and a turncoat for mentioning these things," said Zinni, 60. The problems in Iraq are being caused, he said, by poor planning and shortsightedness, such as disbanding the Iraqi army and being unable to provide security.

Zinni said the United States must now rely on the U.N. to pull its "chestnuts out of the fire in Iraq."

"We're betting on the U.N., who we blew off and ridiculed during the run-up to the war," Zinni said. "Now we're back with hat in hand. It would be funny if not for the lives lost."

Several things have to happen to get Iraq back on course, whether the U.N. decides to step in or not, Zinni said.

Improving security for American forces and the Iraqi people is at the top of the list followed closely by helping the working class with economic projects.

But it's not the lack of a comprehensive American plan for Iraq nor the surging violence that has cost allied troops their lives – including about 30 Camp Pendleton Marines – that most concerns Zinni.

"In the end, the Iraqis themselves have to want to rebuild their country more than we do," Zinni said. "But I don't see that right now. I see us doing everything.

"I spent two years in Vietnam, and I've seen this movie before," he said. "They have to be willing to do more or else it is never going to work."

Last night at the Kroc institute during his speech "From the Battlefield to the Negotiating Table: Preventing Deadly Conflict," Zinni detailed the approach he believes the United States should take in the Middle East.

He told an overflow crowd that the United States tries to grapple with individual issues in Middle East instead of seeing them as elements of a broader question.

"We need to step back and get a grand strategy," he said.

Spot on, this guy knows what he's talking about. And he's got integrity too; he resigned on the eve of the invasion because of his principles.

[The Yosemite Bear]

Well fuck we know that the vietnam vets crowd hates Rummy....

we know the feeling is mutual

we know that if they could have it there way all of the pols would completly disavow anything happening in the sixties....

you know, no pot, no kennedy's, no Dr. King, no Vietnam. It's just too embarrising to the corprate do nothings of today....

[Hamel]

I'm wondering when they'll break out the hindsight 20/20 excuse for this entire fuckup.

[BlkbrryTheGreat]

I'm wondering when they'll break out the hindsight 20/20 excuse for this entire fuckup.

Silly boy, if there is anything the Bush administration is good at its making excuses.

[Omega-13]

I watched the entire interview, and rummy was sweating bullets up there for a few of those questions,

he was so unsure of his OWN answer about not predicting the deaths that he had to repeat it more and more carefully after each reporters question about it,

he tried to leave the stage a few times with general myers (i believe it was myers) but he kept coming back to address that issue,

if i was a US soldier and I heard that someone at the whitehouse, especially rummy said that he couldn't have predicted the deaths, i'd be furious,
why are these people planning this if they can't predict a reasonable future.!

[Glocksman]

Zinni has the reputation of being a no-bullshit leader with tons of integrity, brains, and a strong sense of duty.

Given a choice between Rumsfeld's advice or Zinni's, I'd take Zinni's any day.

[The Yosemite Bear]

Of course there are those in the military that refuse to awknoledge even the smallest points...

Like that the powder issued with the Vietnam Era M16's+no barrel croming+The first 800 rifles being chambred for a different caliber+only having 1 cleaning kit for every 10 rifles being made=A life threatening logistical fuckup on the part of the Brass/politicians

nope they perfer to blame the "Lazy Draftees" who they claim were too stoned to understand the weapon in the first place....

Oh and while defoliant contains chemical that causes birthdefects in animals and people. There is nothing wrong with exposing our troops to said defoliant, noe is there any link between said defoliant and the number of vietnam vets, and their children who suffer from cancer, lukemia, etc.

[phongn]

To be fair, did the DOD actually know that the various defoliants contained dioxin in them?

[Trytostaydead]

I really don't understand what the Whitehouse was thinking when it planned Iraq. I can accept maybe Bush is not the brightest kid on the block.. but you'd think his advisors and their advisors would have something on their shoulders. What were they thinking, "we topple Saddam and then we ride into Baghdad like we did in France?" That the radical clerics, jihadists, terrorists, loyalists, etc would throw flowers at US troops?

[Dahak]

I really don't understand what the Whitehouse was thinking when it planned Iraq. I can accept maybe Bush is not the brightest kid on the block.. but you'd think his advisors and their advisors would have something on their shoulders. What were they thinking, "we topple Saddam and then we ride into Baghdad like we did in France?" That the radical clerics, jihadists, terrorists, loyalists, etc would throw flowers at US troops?

IIRC that was the general idea.
Things like that seem to happen if you run around with ideological blinders...

[Durandal]

This isn't exactly news. The administration ignored the warnings from everyone, not just Zinni. Any person with a functioning brain could've foreseen the consequences of our invasion from cultural and religious perspectives.

Instead, the administration listened to Iraqi exiles, who told them that Iraq was a horrible place and that everyone would love America for coming in. Really? I was unaware that a formal poll had been conducted among a suitable sampling of the Iraqi populace. They're exiles. Of course they're going to tell you shit like this. I seriously doubt that they associated much with people who were satisfied with the government.

[MKSheppard]

I seriously doubt that they associated much with people who were satisfied with the government.

And that segment consisted of everyone who worked for the Ba'ath party
and no one else

[Durandal]

I seriously doubt that they associated much with people who were satisfied with the government.

And that segment consisted of everyone who worked for the Ba'ath party
and no one else

I'm talking about the every day people in Iraq. You know, the ones who went to work every day and had the same problems that people in America do. To a lot of them, Saddam maintained order and, so long as they kept their mouths shut, they'd lead perfectly normal lives. For lots of people, that's an acceptable compromise, but obviously not for you or me. Historically, that's how dictatorships stay in power.

Even if the majority of people in Iraq wanted Saddam gone, I seriously doubt that those same people would want an American puppet government in his place.

[MKSheppard]

I'm talking about the every day people in Iraq. You know, the ones who went to work every day and had the same problems that people in America do.

Car dealership owners had problems with Uday and Qusay taking
vehicles off their lots without payment, and associates of Saddam forcing
their way into partnerships with them and taking most of the profits
while doing nothing.

[The Yosemite Bear]

well the paper "Chronicle" says Colin Powel is clashing with Chaney, and Rumsfeld publicly over iraq....

[PainRack]

This isn't exactly news. The administration ignored the warnings from everyone, not just Zinni. Any person with a functioning brain could've foreseen the consequences of our invasion from cultural and religious perspectives.

.

It gets even better. Rumsfield, Cheney and even Paul had pretty much said the exact same things that would happen if the US had advanced into Iraq and occupied it.