Jump To Lightspeed: Crap Imperial Fighters?

SPOOFE · Post by **SPOOFE** » 2004-10-17 11:19pm

I was reading this article on IGN, curious to see what Jump To Lightspeed would bring us. I noticed one thing very early that made my heart sink...

We needed a stronger, more armored looking fighter for our Empire Faction players to use as a gunship, so we started with the base design of the TIE-Fighter. We noticed that there were already more variations of the TIE-Fighter from the fiction then we were initially aware of, so we knew we had some latitude to play with in terms of the over all concept.

This quote tells me two things: One, the game designers know FUCK ALL about the Expanded Universe (GREAT research there, guys! No wonder Galaxies is such a success!

), and Two, we're not gonna see any established non-movie TIEs. No TIE Defender, no TIE Avenger, no Gunboats...

No, instead, we get crap like the "TIE Oppressor" (essentially looks like they ripped the Defender) and some crappy VT49 "TIE" Decimator. Look what they wrote about the Decimator:

it had to be as cool, if not cooler, than the Falcon.

Good luck there, you yahoos.

Remember a while back when one of the Galaxies designers was bitching about the fan community giving him shit? They deserve it if this is the sort of drek that they're calling a "game" these days. GREAT research, guys. Wonderful. Way to shit in the fan's faces. Way to show gratitude to the fanbase that lets you feed your family.

Soontir C'boath · Post by **Soontir C'boath** » 2004-10-17 11:31pm

Man, if they were looking to create something innovative, putting three solar panels of Interceptor design and turning the cockpit around with some weird fucking engine does not cut it.

The freakin Decimator just looks like the fucking YT-2000 in XWA. Fucking crackerjacking pieces of crap.

Awful. Well at least it's not a new day, yet.

Sharp-kun · Post by **Sharp-kun** » 2004-10-18 12:04am

The VT49 will definitely be one of the high status ships for Imperial players, and I'm sure every Imperial player will be salivating at the thought of getting their hands on one!

Replace VT49 with Defender and I would agree.

Seriously, we had perfectly good designs that fans loved. They should have been given priority, and worry later about new designs.

Stofsk · Post by **Stofsk** » 2004-10-18 12:04am

Oppressor looks like a piece of shit. The Decimator doesn't look like a fighter, and the good thing is it looks different. However, what about the Gunboat, Missileboat, and Defender?

What the hell is this game anyway? I don't read SW Game articles. If it isn't KOTOR I don't care.

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2004-10-18 12:06am

Okay, that just sucks.

Sharp-kun · Post by **Sharp-kun** » 2004-10-18 12:07am

Stofsk wrote:However, what about the Gunboat, Missileboat, and Defender?

The developers want to jerk off to the fact that they've designed a TIE, and its got into a game.

Stofsk wrote:What the hell is this game anyway? I don't read SW Game articles. If it isn't KOTOR I don't care.

Space combat add on for Galaxies.

Sarevok · Post by **Sarevok** » 2004-10-18 12:20am

Anyone know about the capships in Jump to Lightspeed ? The Sony site does not mention any.

Utsanomiko · Post by **Utsanomiko** » 2004-10-18 12:26am

The VT49 Decimator is supposed to be an Imperial counterpart to the YT-1300 and the Rebel multi-person ship (I assume they have one). It's supposed to be a multi-passenger craft with a full interior to walk around in and store items, but they could have used a real design like a Skipray Blastboat, or some better gunship/star monitor, I will admit. A Lamda shuttle would have been neat, but maybe too small.

It's the Aggressor and worse the TIE Oppressor that bug me. First of all the TIE Defender is right there, and oficially story-wise was being developed before the battle of Endor so knowing Sony they could have fudged the deployment date of such a limited eliete ship (they're apparently doing the same with the B-Wing). I'd be more likely to accept the TIE Agressor if there weren't two TIEs that hinted at the team's backwards-wing fetish. Its backstory is stupid and backwards, too (Rebel presence didn't increase untill after the DS1 was blown up, that's the whole point!).

And capital ships are not player-controlled in current plans for the game. They show up in the game, but you can't own one or serve onboard one.

Sharp-kun · Post by **Sharp-kun** » 2004-10-18 12:29am

Utsanomiko wrote:The VT49 Decimator is supposed to be an Imperial counterpart to the YT-1300

Why? The YT-1300 is acivilian freighter. Why does the Empire need a counterpart? Why not just go down to the local used starship yard and torture the owner into giving them some?

*Bangs head off wall*

Utsanomiko wrote:and the Rebel multi-person ship (I assume they have one). It's supposed to be a multi-passenger craft with a full interior to walk around in and store items, but they could have used a real design like a Skipray Blastboat, or some better gunship/star monitor, I will admit. A Lamda shuttle would have been neat, but maybe too small.

Delta DX-9 Transport would have worked, or better yet one of the Assault Transports or SPC's.

Stofsk · Post by **Stofsk** » 2004-10-18 12:30am

Actually a Lambda shuttle doesn't seem to be too small, since it can fit a commando team and enough equipment for what, a dozen men? Not including the command crew? And droids as well? Plus the bitch has fuck-off weapons as well. I actually wouldn't mind flying a Lambda, it also happens to look really cool.

The Cleric · Post by **The Cleric** » 2004-10-18 12:33am

Stofsk wrote:Actually a Lambda shuttle doesn't seem to be too small, since it can fit a commando team and enough equipment for what, a dozen men? Not including the command crew? And droids as well? Plus the bitch has fuck-off weapons as well. I actually wouldn't mind flying a Lambda, it also happens to look really cool.

But they are small in regards to freighters.

Utsanomiko · Post by **Utsanomiko** » 2004-10-18 12:33am

Sharp-kun wrote:
Utsanomiko wrote:The VT49 Decimator is supposed to be an Imperial counterpart to the YT-1300
Why? The YT-1300 is acivilian freighter. Why does the Empire need a counterpart? Why not just go down to the local used starship yard and torture the owner into giving them some?

I mean in muiltperson capability. The way the game is set up, the ships are divided into 3 professions in regards to their accessibility. Meaning each faction (plus neutral) for now get one combat-capable multiperson ship. So technically ships in these lines aren't exactly heavyily-armed craft, but they're still quite combat-capable.

Utsanomiko wrote:and the Rebel multi-person ship (I assume they have one). It's supposed to be a multi-passenger craft with a full interior to walk around in and store items, but they could have used a real design like a Skipray Blastboat, or some better gunship/star monitor, I will admit. A Lamda shuttle would have been neat, but maybe too small.
Delta DX-9 Transport would have worked, or better yet one of the Assault Transports or SPC's.

Probably. Can't recall what those looked like, though. *Goes to look it up*

SPOOFE · Post by **SPOOFE** » 2004-10-18 01:24am

But they are small in regards to freighters.

Not really. A Lambda is a rival for the Falcon, in size (disregarding the wings, of course).

But that misses the point... think of this: Anyone remember the Bulwark cruiser? The out-of-the-ass SSD-rivaling Rebel ship that was thrown into the game Rebellion? This is the same thing... rather than CREATIVELY making parity between the warring factions, they're just making a direct ship-to-ship counterpart between the Imperials and the Rebels.

In other words... the only reason the Rebels used freighters was because they couldn't afford good ships. Why would the Empire use freighters? They already HAVE good ships.

Throwing an "Imperial" freighter into the game is stupid, pointless, and uncreative.

Fuck the design team, I say. Buncha circle-jerking monkeys. Galaxies coulda been a good game, too... oh well.

Cal Wright · Post by **Cal Wright** » 2004-10-18 01:38am

I've had fun in both. Granted signing the NDA I can't say shit about anything. However I was surprised at thier choices.

Utsanomiko · Post by **Utsanomiko** » 2004-10-18 01:43am

Actually, the problem seems to be they've bukled-up the YT-1300 into some sort of freighter-gunship for mercenary/freelance pilots, and stuck it up at the top of the ladder of flyable ships (I think that's what they've oficially said). Since each pilot profession seems to have 6 fighters and then a multiperson ship, they're including a rebel and Imperial ship as counterparts to this uber assault vessel. They didn't design the system to have multiperson ships in any other fashion other than one fighter/transport each, unfortunately.

And the Rebel vs Imperial fighters lineup seems straightup as well. Guess they don't trust their ability to balance rugged heavy fighters vs fast nimble ones (hell, they didn't manage pistols vs carbines vs rifles in ground combat).

SPOOFE · Post by **SPOOFE** » 2004-10-18 02:06am

the problem seems to be they've bukled-up the YT-1300 into some sort of freighter-gunship for mercenary/freelance pilots, and stuck it up at the top of the ladder of flyable ships

Yup, ignoring the fact that a YT-1300 was kind of a crap ship, considered obsolete by everyone than Han met... the only reason the Falcon performed as well as it did was because of the extensive modifying.

If they wanted to make ship modification a big part of this add-on, why'd they have it so you get a hotrod as the starting point? Where do you go from there?

Poorly designed, I tell you! Bah. I think I'm just gonna wait for KOTOR II, as well... ::sigh::

Post by **weemadando** » 2004-10-18 02:12am

Try the d20 Star Wars game... Jesus Christ, being in a TIE or any Imperial ship in that game is suicide.

Since when has a Y-Wing had more maneuverability than a TIE Fighter?

Why does a TIE Interceptor get outrun by X-Wings?

Why are all Imperial ships inherantly sucky?

Sure, the game ASSUMES that you'll be playing as rebels and as such cripples the Imperial ships and weapons horribly...

Tech^salvager · Post by **Tech^salvager** » 2004-10-18 10:58am

Why are they using Darth Vaders TIE? Why not the actual TIE Advanced I don't what type of TIE Darth Vaders is acutally So I am just calling it a TIE.
Why the hell do imperials need a freighter to match the falcon, pointless, thers plenty of craft that the imps have that could annihailate the falcon. And the new TIE looks really dumb IMHO, gessh we take some panels off the TIE advancde design and we have a new starfighter.

Post by **Kuja** » 2004-10-18 11:01am

TIE Decimator

Theycall that thing a TIE?:wtf:

Straha · Post by **Straha** » 2004-10-18 01:07pm

Kuja wrote:
TIE Decimator
Theycall that thing a TIE?:wtf:

Twin Ion Engine, so yeah TECHNICALLY it could be a tie.

Quite frankly I'm glad that I didn't pick up Galaxies when it came out, especially with this stuff flying around.

SPOOFE wrote:Remember a while back when one of the Galaxies designers was bitching about the fan community giving him shit? They deserve it if this is the sort of drek that they're calling a "game" these days. GREAT research, guys. Wonderful. Way to shit in the fan's faces. Way to show gratitude to the fanbase that lets you feed your family.

Eh, I think the blame would belong on both sides here. Oral minority of the fan community gives designers/programmers shit ideas about what to do for Galaxies, designers placate them, minority is now spurred on and starts spewing even more shit demanding more stuff, designers try to placate them, minority demands what they wanted not what they got, and also wants more stuff, and so it continues in a vicious circle.

Cyborg Stan · Post by **Cyborg Stan** » 2004-10-18 02:27pm

TIE Oppressor, Aggressor, Decimator? Why would anybody decide to name fighters like that? What's next, "I am a Bad Guy" bumper stickers as a requirement? Or maybe the "TIE Rapist"?

Vendetta · Post by **Vendetta** » 2004-10-18 02:33pm

weemadando wrote:Try the d20 Star Wars game... Jesus Christ, being in a TIE or any Imperial ship in that game is suicide..

Being in a (basic) TIE of any sort has always been suicidal, they're designed for mass production and expendability, who gives a shit if they don't come back, they grow on trees.

Sharp-kun · Post by **Sharp-kun** » 2004-10-18 02:43pm

Vendetta wrote: Being in a (basic) TIE of any sort has always been suicidal, they're designed for mass production and expendability, who gives a shit if they don't come back, they grow on trees.

Not quite. The TIE was an excellent fighter in the hands on a pilot who could use it right, and those pilots would come back.

Alan Bolte · Post by **Alan Bolte** » 2004-10-18 03:48pm

Against basically anyone but the Rogues even your basic TIE fighters could hold their own; their size generally makes up for their shielding. Certainly, they are cheaper than rebel craft or heavier fighters like the Defender, but that is due largely to the lack of a hyperdrive, which isn't necessary for the roles such fighters were expected to perform. Indeed, there have been indications that some level of combat-grade shielding or other devices could be added without drops in speed or firepower, which probably results in an increase in radiation from cooling, and therefore makes the ship somewhat easier to target, not enogh to offset the protection of shields but enough to make the marginally increased survivability not worth the expense. Furthermore you have elite TIE squadrons which were known to cause even such elites as the Rogues problems despite their lack of shielding.
The TIE Fighter clearly outmatched most starfighters commonly in use at the time of its design, and the need for a faster, more powerful craft was not seen until the Rebels were able to mass-produce the X-Wing, not more than a few years before Yavin, if that.

As to the game... I'm not surprised. It's not like we can ever expect anything grand or exciting in that respect from Lucasarts. They can get some pretty decent gameplay out sometimes, and maybe they'll get some cool themes together, but I basically just expect anything out of them to feel like a mid-quality fanfic. Surprises happen, but not this time. Definitely don't ever expect a real flight sim out of them, you won't get it except by fan creation, and I don't even see it as likely to come from fans because far too many are too influenced by TIE Fighter, I've found.

SPOOFE · Post by **SPOOFE** » 2004-10-18 04:25pm

What's next, "I am a Bad Guy" bumper stickers as a requirement? Or maybe the "TIE Rapist"?

TIE Pedophile?

TIE Fascist?

TIE Carrot Top?