Best theme for Ep 3 duel?

Post by **Vympel** » 2004-12-08 11:23pm

Several options:

- Duel of the Fates (with a few adjustments, because music is hardly ever exactly the same as in previous films with SW)
- Return of the Jedi style (Luke's rage, Emperor's theme, etc)
- Empire Strikes Back style (mostly silent except for a few key scenes like Vader's uber telekinetic attack)
- A New Hope style (no music at all)

Basically, do you want music to play a big part, or only have it kick in at several points, and if so, what music?

UCBooties · Post by **UCBooties** » 2004-12-08 11:29pm

I know it can be overdone, but I'm a huge fan of dramatic music. It just seems to fit so well for Star Wars. I thought Duel of the Fates was awesome. I guess the music has always just seemed like such an essential part of Star Wars, and while I know it didn't play a big part in earlier duels, I think it's extremely effective for dramatic efect.

Drooling Iguana · Post by **Drooling Iguana** » 2004-12-08 11:56pm

The lack of music during most of the lightsabre battles in the OT worked well because they enhanced the suspense. You didn't know who would win in the Vader/Obi-Wan fight or in the Luke/Vader fight. In ROTJ, you knew that, should Luke to choose to attack Vader, he would most likely win, with the suspense being based on whether or not he'd turn to the darkside in doing so. For that, the dramatic music worked well, because even though the scene revolved around two guys whacking each other with laser-swords, the real conflict was an internal one.

Likewise, everyone will already know how the duel in RotS turns out, if not from the fact that it was described in the RotJ novelization then from the mere fact that Obi-Wan is still in one piece during the OT, while Vader requires cybernetics to sustain him. Dramatic, ROTJ-style music would be best for this, since there would be no suspense in the fight itself. The drama would merely come from watching that runaway train speed toward its forgone conclusion.

Macross · Post by **Macross** » 2004-12-09 12:12am

I saw snippets of the fight in the OT DVD extras. Even though it was just Obi-Wan and Anakin against a green screen, the fight still looked intense.

Personally, I hope they dont use any music for the scene. The hum and cracks of the lightsaber should be the only things heard during the fight.

Master of Ossus · Post by **Master of Ossus** » 2004-12-09 12:56am

Macross wrote:Personally, I hope they dont use any music for the scene. The hum and cracks of the lightsaber should be the only things heard during the fight.

I totally disagree. The music could make or break that fight, and it should be appropriately epic in scale--the Galaxy literally revolves around what happens during the duel.

Stofsk · Post by **Stofsk** » 2004-12-09 12:57am

Vympel wrote:- A New Hope style (no music at all)

That's not quite true: just before Obi-wan 'surrendered' and Vader cut him down, music get's played.

Post by **Vympel** » 2004-12-09 01:01am

I loved it how Vader didn't even hesitate. Just: "wtf? Idiot!" *swipe*

Stofsk · Post by **Stofsk** » 2004-12-09 01:04am

Vympel wrote:I loved it how Vader didn't even hesitate. Just: "wtf? Idiot!" *swipe*

Then he stamped on Ben's cloak. "That'll show him to mess with me! I'm the best!" You'd think he'd wonder wtf just happened, but no...

The Dark · Post by **The Dark** » 2004-12-09 01:31am

Stofsk wrote:
Vympel wrote:I loved it how Vader didn't even hesitate. Just: "wtf? Idiot!" *swipe*
Then he stamped on Ben's cloak. "That'll show him to mess with me! I'm the best!" You'd think he'd wonder wtf just happened, but no...

I always thought he was wondering wtf...it was basically a "where'd he go?" move.

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2004-12-09 01:45am

Yeah, I've always interpreted Vader's foot probing as sort of a "what just happened here" action.

For the duel, I'd have to say silent in some parts, but with a compromise of all the above at other times.

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2004-12-09 04:48am

Duel of the Fates. All the way. With the Imperial March as Vader escapes the lava.

And then an Austin Powers style "Help! I'm not dead, but I'm very badly burned!" (Okay, not really.)

Petrosjko · Post by **Petrosjko** » 2004-12-09 05:46am

The way I envision it? If you're going for the cut in and out flavor of the duel from RotJ or TPM, start it out in total silence as Anakin and Obi Wan trade words. Then Anakin fires up his lightsaber, and the audio lays heavily on that sound effect before he strikes, with Obi Wan bring his up just in time to deflect the first attack...

Then cut to whatever other big scene is happening, and work the music in on the transition from that scene back to the fight, where the two are busy doing some seriously acrobatic and dramatic dueling.

White Haven · Post by **White Haven** » 2004-12-09 09:30am

Vader: Dammit, his wallet's gone too!

Crown · Post by **Crown** » 2004-12-09 09:38am

Spanky The Dolphin wrote:Yeah, I've always interpreted Vader's foot probing as sort of a "what just happened here" action.

I thought that it was, wasn't it shown in the novelization as such

Stravo · Post by **Stravo** » 2004-12-09 10:27am

I always assumed that we would hear a very intense and powerful version of Duel of Fates - I mean the title says it all - the Duel of Fates, I certainly don't consider the Maul duel to have been fate worthy. PLus we've seen almost all the music from TPM recycled into AOTC so I believe we'll see more recycling into ROTS.

The version we heard in TPM was a teaser of what we would hear in ROTS - IMO.

Stofsk · Post by **Stofsk** » 2004-12-09 11:12am

Stravo wrote:I always assumed that we would hear a very intense and powerful version of Duel of Fates - I mean the title says it all - the Duel of Fates, I certainly don't consider the Maul duel to have been fate worthy.

Well, if you interpret it in the end result of the duel:

1. Qui-gon gets killed.
2. Maul gets killed.
3. Obi-wan survives.

Now why is this fateworthy? One: Qui-gon dies, leaves Anakin without a suitable mentor to guide him down the right paths. Two: Maul dies, which leaves an opening for an apprentice position in Sidious' employment. What would have happened if Maul lived? What would have happened to Dooku? The separatists! And finally three: Obi-wan is neither a master nor a teacher, yet jumps at the chance to teach Anakin because he promised Qui-gon he'd do it. We know ahead of time that Obi-wan failed in this role.

So really, Duel of the Fates is entirely appropriate for that duel. It is the first lightsaber duel in the saga, and the fallout from it shapes the rest of the saga. If you don't find that fate-worthy, Stravo, then man...

The version we heard in TPM was a teaser of what we would hear in ROTS - IMO.

I don't know. GL seems to make his movies one at a time, which is odd - and a fault, IMO - given the continuing nature of the saga.

But I will be looking forward to it.

Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman · Post by **Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman** » 2004-12-09 11:17am

Actually I'm hoping for something really *new*; another original masterpiece by John Williams, perfectly tailored for Anakin-Obi Wan's duel, and will be as memorable as Imperial March.

Or maybe they should go for Face To Face's punk version of Popeye the Sailor Man

:runs away:

Stravo · Post by **Stravo** » 2004-12-09 11:18am

Stofsk wrote:So really, Duel of the Fates is entirely appropriate for that duel. It is the first lightsaber duel in the saga, and the fallout from it shapes the rest of the saga. If you don't find that fate-worthy, Stravo, then man...

No, there was nothing fate worthy about TPM. Yes, I recognize what you're saying about the impact of the duel but just didn't come across on the screen. When Maul died there was a general shrug from me. OK, Obi Wan won...cool duel but where's the punch line?

Obi Wan and Anakin dueling...THAT'S what the Prequels have been leading up to from Episode I. That's fate worthy. That's what we've all been waiting for.

And if you want to know what I find fate worthy read Starcrossed or Twilight War.

Stofsk · Post by **Stofsk** » 2004-12-09 11:30am

Stravo wrote:
Stofsk wrote:So really, Duel of the Fates is entirely appropriate for that duel. It is the first lightsaber duel in the saga, and the fallout from it shapes the rest of the saga. If you don't find that fate-worthy, Stravo, then man...
No, there was nothing fate worthy about TPM. Yes, I recognize what you're saying about the impact of the duel but just didn't come across on the screen.

I know what you mean about that. GL didn't do TPM right, IMO, but I felt the duel was at least one of the best parts of the movie. As you say, there was no 'punchline'.

Still, Lucas does concede that you're supposed to watch them in sequence with each other, to fully 'get' it.

When Maul died there was a general shrug from me. OK, Obi Wan won...cool duel but where's the punch line?

Admittedly the three points I made came to me just now, and NOT when I saw the films. Nevertheless, I did think the duel of the fates was a good title and theme for that duel.

Obi Wan and Anakin dueling...THAT'S what the Prequels have been leading up to from Episode I. That's fate worthy. That's what we've all been waiting for.

Yes it's fateworthy, but in a different way. That duel will be the final spinning as the galaxy goes down the tube. The Maul duel was fateful in it's own way.

And if you want to know what I find fate worthy read Starcrossed or Twilight War.

Shit. I fucking forgot about that.

It's just that you've been so busy I forgot about the updates... ARGHH!!! I gotta read up on what you've got.

Enforcer Talen · Post by **Enforcer Talen** » 2004-12-09 02:48pm

for the classically inclined, look up carl off - carmina burana - o fortuna.

duel of the fates is strongly based on it, imo.

Lord Pounder · Post by **Lord Pounder** » 2004-12-09 04:47pm

I'd go with Dual of The Fates. It's been the best part of the PT so far.

THEHOOLIGANJEDI · Post by **THEHOOLIGANJEDI** » 2004-12-09 10:03pm

Vympel wrote:Several options:

- Duel of the Fates (with a few adjustments, because music is hardly ever exactly the same as in previous films with SW)
- Return of the Jedi style (Luke's rage, Emperor's theme, etc)
- Empire Strikes Back style (mostly silent except for a few key scenes like Vader's uber telekinetic attack)
- A New Hope style (no music at all)

Basically, do you want music to play a big part, or only have it kick in at several points, and if so, what music?

I think it should be a mix of themes. From The Imperial march to Duel of the Fates, and a bit of ROTJ style. I have total faith in Williams to do it to satisfy me.

Tychu · Post by **Tychu** » 2004-12-09 11:30pm

In my opinion the best music to be played in the Anakin/ObiWan fight is the Imperial March, tweeked of course but have the coming of the Empire feel to it.

You know what, the whole movie should have the Imperial March playing, its the best song in Star Wars

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Best theme for Ep 3 duel?

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