Roman Legions at the Seige of Gondor

[Stormbringer]

Instead of Sauron's hordes attacking Minas Tirith it's the Roman Legions. They'll be fully familiar with Gondorihm and Minas Tirith anmd vice versa. The Roman legions will be under Sauron's command but not one beast of his is allowed. The Riders of Rohan will be on the way same as before.

So does the Tower of the Guard fall and the White City burn?

[Sea Skimmer]

Depends, do they have the parts of there usually array of siege equipment already on hand?

[Stormbringer]

Depends, do they have the parts of there usually array of siege equipment already on hand?

What ever they would have after a march like in the book. So they'd have whatever equipment they would normally have.

Although, I'd be willing to give them Grond.

[Durandal]

The Romans would be using their artillery in such a seige. They'd have catapults, flaming arrows, basilikas (sp?) and the like. I don't know if Sauron's forces had any of that. I'm sure the Roman guard could at least bring down a few of the walls.

[Stormbringer]

The Romans would be using their artillery in such a seige. They'd have catapults, flaming arrows, basilikas (sp?) and the like. I don't know if Sauron's forces had any of that. I'm sure the Roman guard could at least bring down a few of the walls.

Sauron had seige engine aplenty. None of them harmed the orginal walls of Minas Tirith. The gate was the only weak point in the old walls.

[Next of Kin]

The Romans make up in terms of courage and resolve where they lack in terms of brute strength (like the orcs and trolls). Durandal, do you mean ballistas?

[Sea Skimmer]

Depends, do they have the parts of there usually array of siege equipment already on hand?

What ever they would have after a march like in the book. So they'd have whatever equipment they would normally have.

Although, I'd be willing to give them Grond.

Well then they'd likely need to make most of there stuff on the spot. The Romans will need a days to really get the bombardment going as a result, they won't be up and running in hours like Sauron's force was. They can take the city but it will take longer.

[Next of Kin]

The Romans would be using their artillery in such a seige. They'd have catapults, flaming arrows, basilikas (sp?) and the like. I don't know if Sauron's forces had any of that. I'm sure the Roman guard could at least bring down a few of the walls.

Sauron had seige engine aplenty. None of them harmed the orginal walls of Minas Tirith. The gate was the only weak point in the old walls.

Would the Romans go in for the kill and try to knock down the walls or would they lay a long, drawn-out siege and place a strangle hold on the city?

[Kuja]

Would the Romans go in for the kill and try to knock down the walls or would they lay a long, drawn-out siege and place a strangle hold on the city?

Siege, I think.

My opinon: Minas Tirith will win, but the battle will be longer and a lot closer.

[NecronLord]

At the seige of Jerusalem (Talk about imperial smackdown) the romans were able to bombard the inside of the city. If all else fails they'd smash up Minas Tirith and wait for winter.

[Typhonis 1]

hmmm the Riders wont be able to help if I remeber my tactics the Roman army built a wall to surroiund the beseiged target it had defenses pointing in both directions ...one Roman general was told town in gual would last through a ten year seige he said fine in the 11th year we will take it

[Perinquus]

I think the Romans would take the city eventually. As expert as the Romans were at the infantry tactics of their day, if there was one thing at which they were even better, it was engineering. Look at the siege of Masada, and the enormous ramp they built under enemy fire. Look at the bridge Caesar's men built over the Rhine, and the Roman siege works around Alesia. There wasn't much of anyplace that could keep them out.

If Minas Tirith were a port city on the model of Constantinople, it might keep them out (that city eventually had the most impressive defenses in the ancient or medieval world), and being a port city, was safer from siege, since supplies could be brought in by ship. Minas Tirith is not in such a favorable geographic location. Eventually, whether they storm the city, or starve it into submission, they'd get in.

[Lord Pounder]

The Romans take it. They have superior experience in taking walled cities. They have the equipment, and they have the time and paitience.

[Durandal]

The Romans make up in terms of courage and resolve where they lack in terms of brute strength (like the orcs and trolls). Durandal, do you mean ballistas?

Oops. I meant "ballistas." You know, giant crossbow things.

[NecronLord]

Yeah though they have sevaral huge crossbows Theres a seige version that throws rocks..

[Patrick Degan]

The Romans take Minas Tirith. Their expertise in siege warfare and military engineering, combined with Roman discipline, give them decided advantages. They do not have to immediately pound down the walls but catapult vats of Greek fire and infected, dead animals to burn the city and decimate its population and army with disease.

If the defenders come out and attempt to charge the Roman lines, the Roman tactics of the Tortoise and Wedge, along with the archery barrage, will make short work of the attackers, while Roman Ala (calvary) ride down the retreating survivors.

In individual combat, the Romans have decided advantages with their flexible body-armour, large shields, and the gladius —designed particularly for the close-quarters kill. Furthermore, Roman training devolved not upon individual heroics but unit discipline and coordination; qualities far superior to fighters hacking wildly with sword and axe.

I would expect the Romans to build multilayered pallisade barriers to encircle Minas Tirith while bringing up their heavy siege ordinance, keeping the defenders suppressed with ballistas and archers. They will isoate the city, sealing its defenders within, and with their large war engines will conduct incindiary bombardment. Starve the defenders out, wait for winter, and be prepared for when they open the gates to make their last, desperate charge.

One year, maximum.

[Alyrium Denryle]

They would also build a huge network of ramps and tunnells. While continually bombarding the fortress. Under the cover of archer, and sling fire, wthey would build a ramp up the walls, and come out in a full testudo formation.

[Next of Kin]

They would also build a huge network of ramps and tunnells. While continually bombarding the fortress. Under the cover of archer, and sling fire, wthey would build a ramp up the walls, and come out in a full testudo formation.

I'm not to familiar with the geography of Minas Tirith. How high are the walls for the romans to build their ramp or scaffold and would they be able to chop down trees from a near-by forrest to provide materials?

[Stormbringer]

They would also build a huge network of ramps and tunnells. While continually bombarding the fortress. Under the cover of archer, and sling fire, wthey would build a ramp up the walls, and come out in a full testudo formation.

I'm not to familiar with the geography of Minas Tirith. How high are the walls for the romans to build their ramp or scaffold and would they be able to chop down trees from a near-by forrest to provide materials?

The out walls around the Pellenor Feilds are fairly low and were easily destroyed.

The inner seven walls are at least a 100 to 150 ft. And there are seven concentric walls around the city proper before you get to the White Tower.

[NecronLord]

The height of the walls would not really matter, it would only make the siege tha much longer, and cause the romans to do that much more killing once they are in.

[Alyrium Denryle]

They once besieged a city(i forget the name) that said they had enough food and water for 11 years. The romans responded by saying that they would take the city on the 12th. The city promptly surrendured

[NecronLord]

Quite so.

[Stormbringer]

They once besieged a city(i forget the name) that said they had enough food and water for 11 years. The romans responded by saying that they would take the city on the 12th. The city promptly surrendured

But would they be able to stand off all the other armies in the mean time?

[Alyrium Denryle]

Yes. They yould throw up a defensive perimeter, consisting of earth embankments, watch towers, moats, caltrops, water filled moats, wooden stake walls, ballistas, catapults, and roman legionaires.

They would do so both facinf in, and out, to keep epople from escaping, or breaking the siege.

[macman]

The main power that Sauron had was fear and the his power to control and subjugate many other races....also the Romans would be hard pressed to deal with some of Gondors allies such as the Ents or the Eagles..I think the battle would be decided by other factors than the relative merits of Rome vs. Gondor...

Also Grandif was nearly as powerful as Sauron (He states to Gimi in the second book that "only Sauron himself was more dangerous than He (Grandif) was. He could tip the battle into Gondors favorite..